Natural Progesterone side effects

by Melissa

My doctor put me on a natural progesterone cream and it made me feel horrible. I was only taking it once a day/ 1 pump which seemed like a lot.

I was breaking out all over my body and very oily. My hair became extremely limp and thin and I felt depressed... not myself emotionally. Is there a secret to taking this? Or is there any other product that might work better for me?

My saliva tests showed that my progesterone levels are very low, so I am already having a ton of other yucky symptoms. The cream just seemed to send me over the edge. Is this normal? Also, I have never been on HRT and I am 36 years old.

Thanks for any info.

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Natural Progesterone side effects

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May 26, 2009
 Natural Progesterone side effects
by: Wray

Hi Melissa. Unfortunately this can happen to women when first using progesterone, not pleasant! Progesterone activates the oestrogen receptor sites, this in turn makes oestrogen the dominant hormone to begin with. If, as it seems, you already had too much oestrogen circulating, it can be far worse than someone with relatively low levels. But once it's suppressed by the progesterone you do start feeling better. You might like to look at a web page we have on this.

You have two options, to reduce the dose you are using, which by the sounds of things is low, if you're only using one pump a day. Or to increase the dose. A lower dose will take much longer for your symptoms to go, a higher dose will be quicker. All the successful studies on progesterone used between 100-200mg/day, which is the amount I feel you should aim for. Take care, Wray.
May 26, 2009
 Do you mean one whole applicator?
by: marg

Are you using the whole of this or just one little squeese a day? I am on this, but take only 1ml twice a day, that is just two little pushes of the cream, the whole applicator lasts ten days. I am in postmenopause, so you should not be taking more at 36. Hope you feel better, get back and tell me how and what you are doing, thanks.
Jun 07, 2009
 Dangerous side effects
by: Anonymous

Synthetic hormones are very dangerous. They are "replicas" of the real thing but synthesized in chemistry laboratories thus they're not natural and that's why the body reacts negatively to them. Avoid them and seek instead solutions through good organic nutrition.
Jun 09, 2009
 Dangerous side effects
by: Wray

Progesterone, although synthesised in a lab, is not dangerous. The molecule is the same as the one the body makes, and using it is merely supplementing a low level. The negative reaction is nothing more than oestrogen dominance occurring, which in itself is not dangerous, but certainly disconcerting! Progesterone has been used safely since the late 40's by countless medical practitioners for their patients. Take care, Wray.
Aug 26, 2009
 In one week I thought I should go to a cardiologist
by: Anonymous

I have tried the cream for one week and although quite athletic (5-8 miles race walking and hill climbing) I could not catch my breath. My throat felt thick, as well as my tongue and my heart pounded.

I logged on and read side effects... everything I was experiencing was in there... sweating, pounding heart, tightness of the throat, feeling winded. The cautions say you should not take if you are asthmatic along with a host of other things. It was terrifying. They say this is a allergic reaction. Be cautious, read up on it. The package had none of these warnings!
LMc
Aug 28, 2009
 In one week I thought I should go to a cardiologist
by: Wray

Hi LMc. The symptoms you were experiencing were merely oestrogen dominance, they do go! As for asthmatics, progesterone has been given successfully by medical practitioners for asthma, generally via injections. I've copied below an excerpt from Dr Dalton's book 'Once a Month', first published in 1978, updated in 1999:

"Fifty years ago the six initial PMS patients, two of whom suffered from migraines, two from epilepsy, and two from asthma, were all housewives with children. Not only did they all report spontaneously that their symptoms always occurred before menstruation, but it was also noticed that they were well during pregnancy, although they all had severe symptoms immediately after pregnancy.

Intramuscular progesterone is the most effective treatment for PMS, so it should be the first choice for those at risk of severe premenstrual symptoms, such as asthma, suicide, assault, or alcoholic bouts, or those at risk of a prison sentence following recurrent conflicts with the law."

Take care, Wray
Nov 02, 2009
 Progesterone trouche
by: Marina

Hello and help please. My progesterone I have just found is down and I need to take it in troche form...

(a) are there any side affects?
(b) are creams or the injection more effective?
(c) this is all new so do any of you out there know of any great sites I can look at as I didn't realise I was even close to this time of my life and don't really know anything about all this in its 1st stage.
Thanks!

Hello Marina, thanks for asking these questions. They are good ones and often raised by people new to progesterone therapy. My best advice is... explore this website. There are almost 1,000 pages of pure content including the links and references to the latest research papers. Take care, Wray.
Nov 05, 2009
 Low progesterone/estrogen dominance
by: Cindy

Two years ago I took a hormone/thyroid saliva/blood spot test. All of my levels were low, along with estrogen dominance. Now 2 years later and still no weight loss all my levels came up normal except for progesterone, which is actually a bit worse. My levels are now .20 prog. and 3.3 est. My doctor raised the progesterone from 75 mg to 100mg and a 35mg pill to take at night, while leaving all the others the same. It's been 4 days, and I feel so angry all day, and sad as well.

Until I read this website, I didn't understand. I had previously read that progesterone is the "happy" hormone and thought I should be feeling better with each day. Although I gained a better understanding here, can you give me any more advice given my results and new dosage? My 50 pound weight gain is hideous, and I am so desperate to start losing.
Nov 11, 2009
 Low progesterone/estrogen dominance
by: Wray

Hi Cindy. I'm a bit confused when you say your doctor 'left all the others the same', what others? Does he have you on other hormones, eg., thyroxine, testosterone? And you say he raised the progesterone to 100mg, is this in a cream form? I have never heard of progesterone in a 35mg dose, it's usually 100mg or 200mg. An internet search confirmed this, but makes me suspect you are being given a progestin, which does come in 35mg doses. If this is the case it would make you feel worse. Please consider using a cream and a dose of 200mg/day progesterone, divided into two, and please read this web page on oestrogen dominance.

If your thyroid is under active, it could be you need the amino acid tyrosine, a lack of this causes the thyroid to slow down. And I believe you have insulin resistance, please see this web page on it. Low vitamin D levels affect the functioning of the thyroid and are behind insulin resistance, please have a test done. Your level should be between 50-90ng/ml. Take care, Wray
Jan 29, 2010
 Progesterone cream
by: Glenice

I have used progesterone cream for 6 years, it gave me back my life. l have had no side effects from it whatsoever and find it far better than HRT ever was to my body. At least I can lead a normal life now.
Feb 14, 2010
 Temporary side effects?
by: Janet

I started using the natural progesterone cream about one week ago and have broken out in terrible acne all over my face and am badly constipated. Will these problems go away after a while?
Feb 22, 2010
 EMAIL ME!
by: Anonymous

Please email me personally I am in a similar situation and would love some support! Thank you, Amy.

>>>
Amy, sorry but we have a policy not to publish email addresses on the site as it can lead to all sorts of spam problems and tends to undermine privacy issues. I hope you understand. Webmaster.
Apr 20, 2010
 severe side effects
by: maryanne

I used the natural progesterone cream in Feb 2010 for 14 days. then came my period 2 days earlier. During the follicle phase I was feeling awful... heart pounding, chest discomfort, tight throat, anxiety, panic attack. Then I felt better during the luteal phase. Now in April I still feel uneasy and irritable, with less discomfort since I stopped using the cream. Should I resume using it since so many people benefit from it. Will the side effects go away soon? Should I give it another try? How much should I use? I am only 44 and still having periods regularly. Please help.
Apr 22, 2010
 Dose and times?
by: Chris

Hi Wray, after reading your replies, I will eventually aim to increase my progesterone dose, I'll do this slowly, I got a mixed result so far, it feels like my imbalances are starting to get sorted although I'm not quite over powering them on 10-20 mg and cortisol still feels pushed.

if I get to 100mg a day for example that a fair bit of cream 5 teaspoons, where can that be applied and how many times a day, e.g. 20mg five times?

Just to confirm... is 20mg progestrone one teaspoon?
Apr 22, 2010
 Severe side effects
by: Wray

Hi Maryanne. You are suffering from oestrogen dominance, this does go with continued use of progesterone. But how much progesterone are you using, as it should be between 100-200mg/day? We do have a web page on oestrogen dominance, please see here. As you are now in the beginning stages of peri-menopause you might like to read more about it here. Take care, Wray
Apr 22, 2010
 Dose and times?
by: Wray

Hi Chris. I think you'll be pleased you increased the amount, it really does work. Symptoms can be worse for a bit, but do go! 20mg/day is the amount we make in a normal monthly cycle, useless if symptoms are being experienced. For instance one woman was using only 30mg/day, feeling better but still had severe PMS and cravings 3 days before her period. I asked her to use 200mg/day, she agreed, but was very apprehensive! She wrote back after her first month saying she had actually gone up to 2tsp, about 330mg/day of progesterone and had sailed through the month, with no symptoms at all. The cream you are using must be a very low dose, for 1tsp to give you 20mg! You would have to use it 5 times a day, costly too. 1tsp of Natpro will give you ±170mg progesterone, 3ml (0.6 tsp) will give you 100mg. The cream can be applied anywhere, as the skin comprises 95% kerotinocytes, these have many receptor sites for progesterone, even hair follicles absorb it well. For more information on how to use it please see here. Take care, Wray
Apr 28, 2010
 reply
by: Chris

Hi, I did up the dose I did struggle quite badly although I'm certain that was the "estrogen reaction" and that will die off, I calmed down on about 40mg now feeling decent/steady, I may push it again soon and just battle through the estrogen feeling.

My only concern I have is if the male body produces 10mg progesterone daily and if I go to 100 mg progesterone, couldn't that excess progesterone lead to excess cortisol, testosterone and estrogen.

If cortisol gets too high it would become a problem hormone?

Progesterone is great so far though I'm almost certain I'm on to a good thing. I've always been the guy that does too much so I'm fighting the waiting game here.

I wish I knew before about the "estrogen effect" in the first week, it completely put me off in the past and I stopped using it, all them years I had progesterone in the bathroom and was searching elsewhere for answers that didn't work.

I got your product on Thursday, I can tell it's much stronger.
Apr 29, 2010
 reply
by: Wray

Hi Chris. I do understand your concern, but progesterone is as safe for men as it is for women. It's so easy to lower the dose once you're feeling fine, I don't think you should worry unduly! It's far better to get rid of adverse symptoms quickly than to suffer from them.

Excess progesterone suppresses cortisol, testosterone and oestrogen, as will any one of these hormones if in excess suppress progesterone. Before you panic about suppressed testosterone and low libido, let me reassure you we have many men using progesterone to increase their libido! Progesterone's affects in men is little known, but the few studies show it's importance in libido, one paper quoting...
"This review attempts to outline specific progesterone mechanisms involved in male sexual behavior, showing that this hormone plays a more relevant role in the control of male sexual behavior than commonly assumed. Although progesterone is a sex steroid, it stands at an important crossroad of these pathways and may be converted either into other sex steroids, to glucocorticoids, or to reduced neurosteroids. Thus, progesterone is of paramount importance and essential in the synthesis of other hormones, specifically of supra-renal corticosteroids, estrogen, and testosterone." And further... "Thus, it may turn out that the significance of testosterone in determining libido and potency has been overstated... the importance of testosterone for central sexual function such as libido or whether it also has an effect on the end orgasm tissues in the penis is still debated." See here. And here.

I do wish the 'oestrogen effect' didn't occur, but it does, even in men! There are over 90 oestrogen mimics now, in our food, water, air and the skin 'care' we all use. The only safe way to suppress it is with progesterone. For more info on these please see here. Take care, Wray
May 12, 2010
 Natural Progesterone side effect question!
by: Anonymous

Please help. I am taking natural progesterone - 100 mg
and as soon as I start it each month after my period I lose my libido COMPLETELY and bloat. The swelling abdomen gets worse each day until the end of the month when I get my period. It hurts like crazy at the end and feels like when you have to hold your pee for a whole day!

As soon as I stop the progesterone I feel much better, my sex drive returns, my puffed belly/ swollen bladder/ colon goes down and because of this my pelvis (which gets displaced by the bloat) shifts back to the proper position which in turns helps my back and neck pain. During my period (not on progesterone) my libido increases to a scary heightened point so by the end of that week I have to start the progesterone to calm it down, but I otherwise feel great during that week and my back hurts less. I have endomitriosis (or at least I did) and I had high estrogen when I was tested, but I HATE the progesterone! I have been on it for at least a year and a half and the side effects never went away. Please help.
May 16, 2010
 I need an advice please!!
by: Anonymous

I am 36 and 4 years ago I had a big emotional chock in my life that lead me to a depression and changed everything about me. At first I thought it will take only few months then I will be better but I was wrong and the stress got worse until I had my hormones tested and when I saw my results I was concerned about my estradiol level which was 526. I thought it was high because I had my test done 2 days before my period and I know it shouldn't be at that level. But my GYN Dr said that wasn't a problem and I shouldn't worry about it but I do. The fact is that I know I have something wrong in my body and I felt the estradiol has something to do with it so I called my family Dr and he advised me to take natural progesterone 50 mg pill everynight before bed. I just started 5 days ago and I don't see a bigger difference but I really wish to go back to be myself again. I really hate how I feel everyday. No energy, sad and angry. How can I make this stop? I have kids that I love with all my heart and I wish I could feel better so I can enjoy being a mom again. Please can anyone tell me what should I do?
May 18, 2010
 Natural Progesterone side effect question!
by: Wray

I can understand you not liking the progesterone, with continual oestrogen dominance symptoms! Progesterone activates the oestrogen receptor sites, so initially making it the dominant hormone, hence your adverse symptoms. So each time you start it they occur, and this is because you are not using enough. If you had endo, which is an oestrogen stimulated problem, and you say you still have high oestrogen, you will have to use at least 200mg/day progesterone to prevent the oestrogen dominance occurring each time. Some women with endo or high oestrogen use up to 400mg/day, so you will have to play around with the amount to find the one which suits you best. Certainly much more than 100mg/day. You might like to see the web page we have on endo here. Take care, Wray
May 18, 2010
 I need an advice please!
by: Wray

Your oestradiol should not be that high before your period, as it's dropping then, it fact it's high for when it should have been taken. The range is 30 - 400 pg/mL for a premenopausal woman. Stress of any kind, and yours sounds like it was bad, causes neurotransmitters to crash, hence your depression. It also causes hormones to become unbalanced too, as stress drops progesterone levels sharply. As progesterone also helps with stress, having little would not have helped the situation. Progesterone activates the GABA receptor sites, GABA is one of our most calming neurotransmitters. Oral progesterone is mostly destroyed by the gut and liver, so it's not a good delivery system. Please see here. And here. Far better are injections, suppositories and creams. The creams have an advantage over the two other systems as it can be used anywhere. The progesterone is absorbed well, please see here. And here. To be effective progesterone should be used twice a day as it's half life is about 13 hours. And please try to use between 100-200mg/day, I think you'll find this helps. You might like to look at this page. It gives info on nutrients which could also help you. If you decide to use a cream, there's more info on how to use it here. Take care, Wray
May 21, 2010
 "Estrogen Dominance"
by: Robin

I'm putting my 2 cents in for the many woman who do NOT have estrogen dominance but who are told over and over and over that that is the cause of their symptoms by well-meaning, but incorrect practitioners. I was told my problems were becuase of estrogen dominance and so I took a very good natural progesterone and for the first day or two I felt great! Then gradually I felt worse and worse and worse and got so bad that I would only walk a few steps and get an asthma attack, whereas I had not had asthma before. I was nauseous, dizzy, exhausted, gained weight, racing heart, etc. etc. I kept hearing, oh that is estrogen dominance and that is just the progeserone activating the receptor sites, just keep taking more!

Well, finally I developed a huge cyst in my right breast, the size of an egg before common sense got a hold of me and I checked out some info and got a saliva test for hormones. Guess what?! Two of my estrogens were normal and one was slightly elevated (as far as I know, women have 3 different types of estrogen in their bodies), but my progesterone was dangerously high, along with cortisol now dangerously high and testosterone dangerously high! I had had these tests previous to taking the progesterone and they were normal. (Actually, estrogen and progesteone were both in the low normal range.)
If I were to have continued taking the progesterone at the advice of women and doctors insisting it was all just estrogen dominance, even though doing no test whatsoever, then I would be dead!

I really do know that most people's intention is to help. And that many women benefit from hormone replacement. But please don't just tell someone their symptoms are all caused by estrogen dominance unless you have some proof to back it up! It can be very very dangerous!

I'm passionate about this because of my terrible experience and the terrible experience of others I know, but I don't mean to be rude to anyone here, so please forgive if it comes across that way!

Best to everyone :)
May 24, 2010
 Estrogen dominance
by: Wray

Hi Robin. I do know how you must have felt and don't think you're being rude, but do have to side with the well meaning practitioners! I have no idea how much progesterone you were using, but it seems from your description far too little, believe it or not! I know your level was high when you had it checked, but saliva values for supplemental progesterone can reach as high as 10,000 to 100,000 pg/ml if 100-200mg/day progesterone was used topically. Were you using this much, and were your levels this high? Please see here. I believe you suffered all those adverse symptoms, because you were continually activating the oestrogen receptor sites with too low a dose, without ever getting to the stage of progesterone dominance. So they continued to blight you. Oestrogen is an excitatory hormone, progesterone is calming, with reference to your heart racing, see here. And here.

Oestrogen is a mitogen, causing cells to divide and multiply, progesterone stops this, hence your breast cyst, please these papers:
Paper 1
Paper 2
Paper 3
Paper 4
Oestrogen also causes weight gain, as it stimulates the fat cells, these in turn produce oestrogen so a cycle is set up. Oestrogen also causes water retention, whereas progesterone is a remarkable diuretic, see here. Progesterone is essential for normal lung function and is effective against asthma, see here.

Space doesn't allow me to give you more papers on the benefits of progesterone, but I can assure you there are hundreds! I hope these are sufficient to help you. Take care, Wray
May 29, 2010
 Estrogen Dominance
by: Robin

Thanks for posting my comment & also your reply. Haven't read all the articles yet, but am eager to. I did read the one on hormone testing, especially the disadvantages of saliva tests. I had a very good lab, I don't ever chew gum, was not taking hormones sublingually or on my face and had actually stopped the cream a month before the test (I was doing topical progesterone for 7 months - EVERY DAY! as my practitioner suggested.) So I think the tests were pretty good as per the article. What is curious is that even in the article, he says that the studies they did did NOT include saliva tests when they did the biopsy of the breast tissue for example, but he said that he could infer that the saliva tests would show high levels even though the blood tests did not. (Because saliva tests do show high levels from topical app.) He did not say that ONLY progesterone would show up high. On my saliva test my progesterone was indeed very high, but my estrogen was normal for 2 and slightly high for one estrogen. From what he says, my estrogen on my saliva test would also have shown up as high if it were high, not just progesterone. Same with testosterone and cortisol, which were way too high as well on my test. I don't have any evidence as of yet that my estrogen was too high. I am eager to read the rest of the articles to see if there is some scientific evidence or proof or testing of me having too much estrogen.

I looked at his chart of symptoms... a very handy chart! I'm going to show it to my doctor as I think she can use it. But honestly, I did not have most of those symptoms before I started taking the cream. I had low body temp and fatigue and hair loss, brittle nails, so some of my symptoms COULD be assumed to be from sex hormone imbalance, but they are also completely consistent with low thyroid! I got male docs who refused to consider that and insisted because I was a woman that something must be wrong with my female bits. Tests did not show this, but they didn't care. I was getting worse and worse and worse, even though taking more and more cream. And I felt better once stopping and have continued to feel better... it would truly have been insane to have taken more cream.... I was going into a coma!

The article states:
"When hormones are delivered topically, serum hormone testing grossly underestimates the bioavailable fraction of hormones in blood and tissue hormone uptake and response. This often leads to continued escalation of dosing despite tissue saturation and symptoms of hormone excess."

This is exactly what happened to me! The article does not say that all saliva tests are wrong. Or that it is impossible to have progesterone excess. I feel like you are saying that it is impossible to have too much progesterone in your body and that you can't have any adverse symptoms at all from too much progesterone. But according the chart in the article, a person CAN have symptoms of excess progesterone.
May 29, 2010
 Estrogen Dominance
by: Robin

Sorry my comment was too long to fit in one post!

As I was saying... I quoted in the article where he says that because blood tests don't show true levels of topical hormones, it can lead to over dosing and negative symptoms. Maybe this is what happened a couple decades ago when estrogen was prescribed for women left and right as the cure all and for menopause symptoms... but it turned out, although it helped some women, that was not what was needed by all women, and in fact, was causing a lot of problems! If women reported adverse effects from taking estrogen, what did the doctors say? That the symptoms were from too LITTLE estrogen and women just needed MORE estrogen! Keep taking more and more, and the women got sicker and sicker. It was all blamed on their bodies, never the hormone they were being given. Yes, some of it was because of synthetic, but what if they just kept taking a beautiful natural estrogen? Would their symptoms have gone away? This is now what is being said about progesterone - now it is all the rage and is being said to be the cure for everything and that everyone needs tons of progesterone and that it can't possibly do any harm at all... just like used to be said about estrogen. And that any adverse reaction you have from it is just because you need more!

What I am promoting is that one thing is not true for all women. That getting a good test is invaluable and should not be ignored. It seems that you are saying to ignore my test and just keep taking more progesterone? I did not get that from the article.

I read on your site I think that NO side effects have ever been reported with taking natural progesterone, but that is not true... they are reported, but either not taken seriously, or are suppressed, or are written off. But even that article says you can have symptoms from excess progesterone. It only makes sense really, because we have many hormones in our body and too much of any would not be healthy. Best!
May 30, 2010
 Estrogen Dominance
by: Robin

Can you give scientific references regarding the idea that progesterone "activates estrogen receptor sites" and how this causes negative side effects and why this would cause a breast cyst?

When I did my saliva lab tests, many considerations were taken into account by the lab, for example, luteal phase, etc., the fact that I had been doing P cream, etc. Some interesting notes the lab gave were:

"Several reproductive hormones exert trophic effects on breast tissue, i.e. cellular division and differentiation. Unchecked trophic stimulation can lead to undesired proliferation of the tissue. Over time breast cysts, hyperplasia and lesions are promoted. Estradiol (E2), Estriol (E3), and Estrone (E1) in descending order of potency exert proliferative influence on breast tissue. PROGESTERONE ALSO EXERTS A PROLIFERATIVE INFLUENCE WITH INCREASING CONCENTRATION. (Their emphasis) On the other hand, testosterone, in the normal to mildly hyper-physiologic range exerts a significant estrogen antagonizing effect..."

They say elsewhere again that progesterone exerts a "concentration-dependent" contribution to proliferation of tissue"... meaning, in greater amounts, vs normal amounts. This is what I had and why my breast seems to have developed a cyst.
May 30, 2010
 Be Careful
by: Anonymous

Everyone please listen to what your own body is telling you and be careful with this stuff. We are all different and react differently to hormonal shifts.

Think about it: When things are running smoothly our bodies produce both estrogen and progesterone at different levels at different times. We don't have constant high levels of progesterone being produced.

I agree with Robin. Diagnosing everyone with the exact same problem and prescribing the exact same solution is dangerous.
May 31, 2010
 Excess Progesterone symptoms
by: Robin

I looked at the chart of hormone symptoms, and one thing I got a lot of on the P cream was headaches... and particularly weird ones, like my head was filled with fluid. I often felt like I wanted to drill tiny holes in my head to drain the fluid.

According to the chart, headaches are also a symptoms of too much progesterone. Also, water retention can be caused by both too much estrogen AND too much progesterone. Progesterone might be a diuretic in some cases, but it was definitely not for me. I saw the article on using P for head injury, but it also GAVE me the symptom of headache and weird fluid retention in the head and elsewhere. I am anticipating you will say that is becuase the P activated the estrogen sites, but the doc's chart says that excess P can cause fluid retention, too. The chart also says a deficiency in P can cause water retention, but I definitely did not have a deficiency in P per my saliva tests.

I had racing heart, but that can also be caused by too much cortisol, which tests showed I had.

All these symptoms have diminished from getting off P cream.

I got one huge cyst in my breast from taking P cream, but I don't have fibrocystic breasts.

But I'm still really curious about how P activates estrogen sites....!

Thanks!
Jun 02, 2010
 Short term benefit long term problem
by: tiara

I first tried OTC progesterone about 8 years ago when hitting perimenopause and major stress at the same time. The remote area I lived in had no natural hormone replacement savvy doctors within a 3 hour drive. After joining several menopause chat groups and reading Dr. John Lee's books I had my hormones tested via saliva and showed low in everything but cortisol.
I started progesterone cream at the recommended dose as soon as the test results came back. I found quick relief--starting within 48 hours, of most initial symptoms from insomnia and anxiety to brain fog and mood swings.
However, after about 8 months, I started getting extreme lethargy in the mornings, brain fog as bad or worse than I had initially, short term memory bad again, hard to focus, balance and coordination off, and blood pressure dropping quite low, as in 85/45 plus hot flashes and night sweats. I initially thought my estrogen dominance was getting worse and increased the dose to a maximum of 1/2 teaspoon twice daily for 3 weeks and a week off. it got much worse. I ran out of cream at one point and that extended break showed me that it was the progesterone triggering it. I cut way back to sort of an on demand when feeling tense or irritable for a night or two with good results. The stress resolved and my other perimenopause symptoms decreased to minimal levels--occasional hot flashes and irrational anger.

Several years later again with extreme stress I found that increasing the dose helped with sleep, etc. again after about 8 months, the dizziness, low blood pressure and brain fog were intolerable. This time it took almost 2 weeks after my last dose of cream for the symptoms to resolve. Hormone testing again showed low levels across the board, this time including cortisol to slightly below normal. However, this time I have access to a qualified bioidentical doctor. Low dose estradiol/estriol cream from a compounding pharmacy is what works for me now. I tried both oral micronized progesterone at low dose and had horrible results again with feeling slow and groggy until mid afternoon. I tried going on and off it without telling my fiance when I had used it. Each and every time he could tell the next day and sometimes for 36 hours. A very low dose of topical cream from a compounding pharmacy can help me if I'm feeling a bit wound up but even that dose paradoxically again I will get hot flashes and night sweats even a couple of hours after application--it will wake me up sometimes and continues the next day.

I'm working with my doctor to balance what works for me. Progesterone alone did not help with and even made worse some symptoms such as vaginal dryness and lowered libido. Simply going off of it resolved those 90% and a few days after starting the estrogen have me feeling much closer to my best.
Jun 03, 2010
 Excess Progesterone symptoms
by: Wray

Hi Robin. I admire your tenacity, and all the reading I gave you to do. I still don't know how much progesterone you were using. You said you used it for 7 months, but every day, why? Unless your symptoms were severe, or you were in P-M when cycles are too erratic to follow, or menopause when we have none, I see no reason for it. It should only be used from ovulation, for the 14 days of the luteal phase.

It would help me to know this to better understand why you had such problems, as I'm still convinced you were using too little and possibly at the wrong time. Both breast cysts and fibrocystic breasts, which can have definitive cysts, are caused by an increase in oestrogen levels, as the papers I sent you point out. Having helped thousands of women (men too) with progesterone, I have yet to find it causes harm, only good. I have yet to find a paper which shows adverse side affects too, but there are thousands on the web, so there could well be one. As for progesterone activating oestrogen receptor sites, there are many ligands, hormones, proteins, oils which all have a bearing on how a particular receptor site responds. There could well be mitigating circumstances in your case, but it's beyond my capabilities and the scope of this site to know what. If you wish to find more papers on the subject Google Scholar is a good place to look for more.

Oestrogen is a known mitogen, one paper says..."Apparently, progesterone can be both proliferative and antiproliferative. Is there a unifying hypothesis that can reconcile this paradox?... with the demonstration of clear biphasic effects on cell cycle progression... In sum, a single pulse of progesterone is transiently growth stimulatory... However, despite the initial proliferative burst, subsequent effects of a single pulse of progesterone are growth inhibitory, characterized by arrest in the late G1-phase of the second cell cycle... In vivo studies involving treatment of patients with high doses of progesterone before breast surgery show fewer mitotic figures when compared with estrogen alone"

These might be of help...
Paper 1
Paper 2
Paper 3

You might like to look at the web page on cancer too, there are many papers you could look at. Take care, Wray
Jun 05, 2010
 Short term benefit long term problem
by: Wray

Hi Tiara. Progesterone does have a paradoxical affect. As I mentioned in the last comment I made on this page, you might like to read the paper I gave. You might like to read this page too.

If you were using the normal dose recommended by manufacturers, the 1tsp a day would be giving you approximately 80mg progesterone per day. I've found it has to be at least 100-200mg to be effective. I still use about 170mg/day and that's after 14 years of using it. By stopping and starting it you would be continually dropping the progesterone level, which then had to pick up again. And each time it would have the same stimulatory affect as before, causing your adverse symptoms. Oral progesterone would have caused problems too, as most of it gets destroyed by the gut and liver, so you would have been getting a very low dose. It's the least effective delivery system, please see here. And here. A low dose topical cream would have the same effect. Progesterone cream is very helpful for vaginal dryness, especially putting some in the vagina at night, and as for libido, many men are using it for that! You might like to see this paper, very interesting, as it explains that testosterone normally given for low libido is probably not the answer but progesterone is. You might like to see this comment on estradiol cream. And these papers on oestrogen. Take care, Wray
Jun 13, 2010
 Week one on natural progesterone
by: Poeme

I have been reading this thread with interest. I have heard so much positive feedback about natural progesterone and couldn't wait to try it. I am 49, menopausal and have dragged myself around for months with menopausal symptoms, such as exhaustion, sleeplessness and hot flushes. I think symptoms have been further exacerbated by Hashimoto's thyroiditis. Well, it's been 5 days now and I feel terrible on the troches. My heart feels jittery, I have been having headaches and I have been tearful and anxious. I wonder if people with autoimmune thyroid conditions have difficulty because it alters the levels of thyroid in the body? I am devastated that I feel worse on natural progesterone.
Jun 15, 2010
 Week one on natural progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Poeme You should have been warned about the initial stimulatory affect progesterone has. It is very disconcerting, I'm not surprised you feel devasted. All autoimmune diseases are low in progesterone, high in oestrogen, hence your bad reaction to progesterone. For more info on this, please see here. Using the troches much of the progesterone is swallowed, it then gets destroyed by the gut and liver. I don't beleive they are a very good delivery system, please see here. So the dose you are actually getting is low, this will merely keep stimulating the oestrogen receptor sites. To overcome this the amount used should be between 100-200mg/day, nearer the 200mg/day initially. The best delivery systems are injections, suppositories and transdermal creams. Absorption of progesterone via a transdermal cream has been found to be as effective as injections and to enter circulation rapidly. Please see here. Please have a vitamin D test done as this is also always low in autoimmune diseases, for more info please see here. Please also see here Take care, Wray
Jul 08, 2010
 just began with progesterone
by: Lisa

Hi Wray, Thank God I found this site!

I have been having severe heart palpitations for a few years now that get worse during the week of my period. I am 47 and because of the cyclical implications my gyn is guessing it is hormones. I have had no other symptoms besides the palps, all cardio tests came back as benign pvc's. They don't feel benign! This has lead me to extreme anxiety, focusing on my heart. I'm not an anxious person typically. I went off the bcp this month and began using the progesterone (dissolving in mouth kind) two nights ago. I have requested the cream instead after reading your advice. I am less anxious this morning, but now I'm really concerned about having the palps return if I go through estrogin dominance! I have had very few palps in the past week.

Is it common to have the estrogen dominance or is there a chance I will not have a worse before it gets better experience?
Jul 22, 2010
 "Natural" progesterone cream ! Go away of it as much as you can ! ASAP !!!
by: Anonymous

Dear all,

Don't listen to this persons who only want to sell their products ! I have terrible asthma since I used this cream and now is very hard to keep it under control !! THERE ARE NOT NATURAL PROGESTERONE CREAM IN THIS WORLD, EXCEPT YOUR PROGESTERONE MAKED BY YOUR OWN BODY !!! I was perfectly health with my lungs before using this cream and since then I can't control this asthma !!! Do not try it ! Do not use more if you feel bad already from it, just stop it forever !!!! Asthma is a very strong allergy to this progesterone cream ! And yes, because it is not natural and the body cannot recognise it as a natural hormone !
Write me to [email address omitted by webmaster as it is against this website's policy to publish emails in order to prevent spam] and I can tell you more things.
Jul 22, 2010
 STOP GIVING YOUR WRONG ADVISE TO ALL THIS POOR WOMEN !!!
by: AYLIN

STOP GIVE YOUR COMMENT TO ALL THIS POOR WOMEN ! ROBIN IS RIGHT ! ROBIN, PLEASE CONTACT ME AGAIN !
I HAD THE SAME PROBLEM AS ROBIN AND I AM SURE A LOT OF WOMEN HAVE THIS PROBLEMS TOO ! I HAVE TERRIBLE ASTHMA SINCE I USED THIS CREAM !!! I HATE THE DAY I CHOOSED TO USE THIS CREAM !

Note from webmaster... Aylin, please refrain from using 'all caps' as this is the web equivalent of shouting and is not in keeping with the spirit of this website. It is our policy to publish all posts irrespective of opinion but any future posts from you that show clear evidence of ill manners will not be published. Thank you.
Jul 23, 2010
 just began with progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Lisa So sorry I missed your comment. Oestrogen is an excitatory hormone, progesterone is calming. It calms by activating the GABA receptor sites, GABA is one of our most calming neurotransmitters. Another calming amino acid is taurine, and I think you are probably lacking this. There is more taurine in the heart than all other aminos combined, it's vital for the heart. Please consider taking it, from 2000-5000mg/day. Please see here. Probably a lack of this, combined with the stimulating affect of excess oestrogen prior to your period, caused the palps. I wish I could say if you would get oestrogen dominance or not, but I can't. It could be you won't as you say you've had very few recently. I'm not sure how much progesterone you were using, but troches are generally about 100mg each, which means you were getting about 10-20mg/day. If you start with the equivalent amount when using the cream, and increase gradually, you might find all is fine. But do try to increase to between 100-200mg/day. I've found it has to be this high to have any real affect. Progesterone should always be used going by symptoms, the more severe the more is needed. Thanks for the kind words! Take care Wray
Jul 23, 2010
 "Natural" progesterone cream ! Go away of it as much as you can ! ASAP !!!
by: Wray

Hi there The asthma you had when using the progesterone was due to the same problem many women have, progesterone initially stimulates oestrogen. This is an excitatory, pro-inflammatory hormone, whereas progesterone is calming. So much so it's used for asthma. And contrary to what you say there is such a thing as natural progesterone, it's used in many different fields. It's given via IV transfusion to brain trauma victims, it's used to prevent miscarriages and pre-term births, for migraines, for neuroprotection, for ageing including Alzheimer's, for cancer and heart disease, for myopathy and much more. You might like to read these papers on it's use in asthma, here and and here. Take care Wray
Jul 23, 2010
 STOP GIVING YOUR WRONG ADVISE TO ALL THIS POOR WOMEN !!!
by: Wray

Hi Aylin None of the advice that is given is wrong, as I give plenty of papers to support the use of progesterone. And as many women testify, progesterone has helped them immensely. I wish you had listened to my advice about your endometriosis, as you could be out of pain too. I've recently helped one woman with pain 24hrs a day. She had booked to have a hysterectomy, which she has now cancelled. She's only been using it for 2 1/2 months, but was pain free within the first month and is feeling wonderful. She is using the amount I suggested to you and it worked, 500mg/day reducing gradually to 250mg/day. No one is forcing any woman or man to use progesterone, the decision is theirs, but to aid them we give as many research papers as we can find on the topic. Take care Wray
Jul 24, 2010
 Side effects of progesterone
by: Mich

I've been taking progesterone cream for 11 days and I too have begun to feel awful. Very lethargic, dry mouth, miserable, easily upset by nasty comments or unpleasant visual sights. I started using it because I read about it on a website, I had problems with hit and miss menstrual problems because of the perimenopause, (I'm 47), plus going from a size 8 to a size 12, I'm not eating anymore than usual and I regularly take cycling exercise, so when I read things like, lose 10lbs in 7 days, I thought, I must try it. Trouble is, I just feel too lousy to continue with it. I've not lost weight either, so ignore that advertising. I think I'll stick to being a bit fatter, at least before the cream I didn't feel at 'death's door'.
Jul 24, 2010
 Progesterone, testerone, and bi-estrogen
by: Patricia

In 2007 I had a complete hysterectomy with bi lateral ooperectomy. My problem is headaches. I get the left sided migraines. Is this from not enough estrogen? I am getting confused with all the contridictions. I have read Breakthrough by Suzanne Sommers and I understood the headaches were from not enough estrogen. My Dr. also gave me testosterone and I have to say I think the testosterone took away my backache and joint pain. I myself have been taking the Bi-estrogen and progesterone and I feel like I am having a hard time breathing while I am running. I also am experiencing heavy leg feelings and skipped heart beats. I was wondering, to save money, can I have the estrogen and progesterone cream combined, or will the molecules become damaged? Kindest regards.
Jul 25, 2010
 heart palpitations from Progesterone
by: Sandy

All very interesting information.

I too have recently started to take P cream and for the first couple of weeks had minor issues and feeling unwell, then things settled and I feel well again... mostly.

The note about the heart palpitations made me want to add my comment. A couple of years ago I had significant scary palpitations and after the better part of a year discovered that it was due to an allergy to bananas. Every 6 months or so I try bananas again and the palpitations come back, so I am fairly sure I stumbled upon the issue. This is just to say that there may be other causes for the palpitations and not necessarily caused by hormonal issues. My experiences have shown me that there are many possible causes for symptoms that are not obvious, so one should never make assumptions without trial and error, as everyone is a bit different.

Good luck. Your posts are all very thought provoking. Thanks for the information.
Jul 30, 2010
 Side effects of progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Mich I'm shocked anyone would suggest progesterone as a quick weight loss solution! Yes it is thermogenic, so speeds metabolism slightly, but it certainly isn't a quick fix. And in their hurry to sell it to you they failed to mention a most important fact, initially it stimulates oestrogen production. Oestrogen is an excitatory, pro-inflammatory hormone and will cause all those symptoms you mention. For more info please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance It is also a mitogen, it stimulates cells to divide and multiply, including fat cells. It also causes water retention. Progesterone suppresses excess oestrogen, but only if enough is used. What amount were you using? It should be between 100-200mg per day, anything less and it will continue stimulating oestrogen causing you to gain more weight, either as fat or water, or both. Yes it's wonderful for peri-menopasue, it saved me from a multitude of unpleasant symptoms, but enough has to be used. For more info please see our page on Peri-menopause. The most probable reason you have gained weight is insulin resistance. This can set in during P-M, as progesterone levels are dropping, but oestrogen remains normal to high. Oestrogen causes insulin resistance. For more info on this please see our page on Insulin Resistance.
Take care Wray
Jul 30, 2010
 Progesterone, testerone, and bi-estrogen
by: Wray

Hi Patricia There are many contradictory things said about progesterone, so much confusion arises. Oestrogen is an excitatory, pro-inflammatory hormone, a high level is found in all inflammatory disorders, including migraines. Progesterone is a calming hormone, and an anti-inflammatory, it's used effectively for migraines. Please see here and here. The breathing difficulty when running is due to the oestrogen again, progesterone is excellent for the lungs. It opens the airways as it's a vasodilator, in fact it's effectively given for asthma too, please see here and here. I don't believe we need extra oestrogen or testosterone for that matter. There are over 90 oestrogen mimics we have to contend with in our environment, and the jury is still out on whether testosterone increases libido, which is what it's normally given for. In fact the evidence is pointing to progesterone for this. There are progesterone/oestrogen combo creams on the market, but I really think you don't need the oestrogen. It's a mitogen, causing cells to divide and multiply, including fat cells. Any form of oestrogen, whether endogenous, bio-indentical or synthetic comes with an increased risk of cancer. Please see our page on HRT. Take care Wray
Jul 31, 2010
 heart palpitations from Progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Sandy Thanks for your excellent comment about other factors causing problems. Unfortunately when starting progesterone a host of unpleasant symptoms occur, which in some instances can cause unnecessary anxiety. We do have a warning about this on the site and the leaflet which comes with the cream. It's essential to be aware of this before using it. It's easily resolved if enough progesterone is used, but often too low an amount is, which stimulates oestrogen further still, and merely prolongs the transition to progesterone dominance. For more info please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. I've found between 100-200mg/day is needed, in some instances where symptoms are severe more will be required. Take care Wray
Aug 08, 2010
 Just starting progesterone
by: Deirdre

I am 37. Since coming off the pill 2 years ago, I have had severe PMS symptoms (VERY sore breasts, depression, anxiety). As soon as I get my period, I feel great again. My dr. just put me on 20 mg. a day of compounded progesterone cream. After 2 days I feel so much worse. I feel so tired and irritable. I'm reading here that 20 mg. is much less than you would recommened. Do you think, at my age, I should just stop and try to combat the symptoms with diet and exercise? I'm afraid if I start now, I'll be on this forever (and, as of today, it's not helping).
Aug 11, 2010
 Just starting progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Deirdre You are right, I do recommend a far higher amount. In fact between 100-200mg/day, for most women anything less is merely going to make matters worse. Progesterone initially stimulates oestrogen, which is what's happening to you now. Please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance for more info. The pill does upset things too, as it stops all ovarian function. Once off it the ovaries do start up again, but slowly, so often ovulation can take many months if not years to occur regularly again. As you are now 37, anovulation is an increasingly common event anyway. It's only after we ovulate that progesterone is made by the ovaries. What this means is the oestrogen and testosterone your ovaries are making in the first half of the cycle, are not being countered by progesterone which is normally made in the luteal or second half, hence your severe PMS symptoms. The only way to prevent the symptoms is to use about 200mg/day progesterone during your luteal phase. Please see our page on How to use progesterone cream for more info on cycle lengths, the luteal phase, and when progesterone should be used. Once symptoms have resolved the amount can be reduced very slowly. I understand your frustration, but I have yet to find anyone able to combat severe PMS with diet and exercise. Mild yes, as mild means lower oestrogen levels than you have, and exercise does help. But all of us have higher oestrogen levels than we should, men included, as there are over 90 oestrogen mimics found in our food, water, air and the skin care we use. Please see this excellent site Our Stolen Future for more info on endocrine disruptors. Research has found progesterone excellent for ageing too, as it prevents lipid peroxidation, atherosclerosis, platelets aggregating and forming clots, dementia and nerve degeneration. It's for these reasons I for one will be using it forever. Take care Wray
Aug 14, 2010
 just started progesterone
by: jovita

Hi! Thanks for allowing us to make comments here. This is very helpful. I started taking progesterone 2 days ago. My doctor said i was in the normal range on all of my hormones but since I have fybrocystic breasts she decided to start me on progesterone. I am taking 50mg orally on days 11-25. I had a hysterectomy 8 years ago which left me with one ovary. I take 2 capsules (25mg) at night time. I sleep very well and when I wake up in the morning I have a lot of energy and I feel like my throat is tighter than normal and I am much more talkative and feel excitement which is not normal for me. By the afternoon I feel sad and less energetic almost like I have the blahs. I also feel more hungry and crave sugar. I am getting scared and it is only my 2nd day of taking this product. Any advice? Thank you!
Aug 16, 2010
 horrible side effects
by: maryanne

Hi Jovita, I had the same side effects that you got, and it only gets worse the longer you use it. Since you just started, I'd recommend you stop using it before full blown of side effects which are much worse than your current symptoms.
Aug 18, 2010
 just started progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Jovita I'm pleased you find the site helpful, the more women are able to ask questions and understand hormones, the better. Although you were told your hormones were in the normal range, undoubtedly the ratio of progesterone to oestrogen is too low if you have fybrocystic breasts. These are caused by excess oestrogen. Please see the following papers here, here and here. Oral progesterone is not the best delivery system, as most gets destroyed passing through the gut and liver, please see our page on Progesterone application methods. Progesterone must be used a minimum of twice a day, as levels drop after about 13 hrs. This is the reason you feel sad, have cravings etc in the afternoon. Oestrogen is rising again, and oestrogen upsets blood glucose. I don't believe you are using enough progesterone either, I generally recommend 100-200mg/day, but via a system which does not destroy it, ie injections, suppositories or a cream. For more info please see How to use progesterone cream. If you wish to continue taking it, the dose should be 300mg/day, as this has been found to work, please see here. Take care Wray
Aug 22, 2010
 Feeling worse...
by: Lara

I've read many comments here and have read the replies- I'm getting that when one starts the nat hormones, you go through a 'worse before it gets better' stage? I'm 39, have had no libido for the past couple of years, extreme PMS- Irritable ALL of the time and just a general sense of feeling depressed- Go in and get a hormone panel done- Results last week cam in Testos-.2 Progest- .3 Estradiol 91.4--- I was prescribed topical cremes for T(15 1mg every other day) and P (.5ml once daily thru days 1-14 then 1ml days 14-21)--- I've been taking these for 5 days now and am having headaches and extreme nausea along with highs and lows of moodiness- Is this typical? Would you up the P creme level? And in your experience, applying Testosterone along with Progesterone... is 'normal' and beneficial to my situation? Thanks so much for everyone's insight- Best, L
Aug 22, 2010
 Progesterone & hormonal seizures
by: Lisa

I started taking the cream a couple of months ago cause I have hormal siezures (Epilepsy) I am perimenapausal & must keep my progesterone up. (I'm staying one step ahead of having seizures cause of the changes occurring). Estogen promotes seizures & progesterone acts as an anti-seizure. So I have to keep my P up during the times it withdraws. (Since I'm losing my own during this stage of my life.) The cream has been good to me, no side effects & has taken care of all the Peri symptoms. It was so hard to find a dr who would prescibe it! I have a prescription which I go to a coumpounding pharmacy to get it.
Aug 22, 2010
 Thinking about starting natural progesterone
by: C. Sue

Hi there. Thank you to all who have commented here, it's been immensely helpful in research for my own personal use.

I'm fairly certain I'm suffering from Estrogen overload. Weight gain, depression, anger, irregular and/or missed periods, and almost debilitating insomnia. My sister said I should look into natural HRT.

I am very concerned that the initial month (or more?) would worsen my depression which can border on suicidal at times, and cause further weight gain which would make me want to jump from a bridge at this point. I just started exercising heavily and any further setback would be too hard.

What am I really getting into and for how long if I take a natural progesterone cream topically (days 14-26 seems to be the advice, day 1 being start of my period)? If it's only a rough patch for a month but then all the other symptoms will ease, I can make it. I just need to be informed before I start what I'm in for.

Much thanks!
Aug 23, 2010
 This is a bunch of Crock!
by: Anonymous

Why are you reccomending 300 mgs of this stuff? Every other site I have read and talked to people say you should not use more than 30 mgs a day of cream. No wonder all these people are having side effects. You are just trying to sell a product not looking our for peoples welfare.
Aug 26, 2010
 Feeling worse...
by: Wray

Hi Lara Yes you are right, progesterone does stimulate oestrogen, vice versa too. You don't give the measurements the hormones were taken in, or whether it was a blood test or saliva. But if you have them, divide the progesterone result by the oestrogen result to get the ratio. But the two hormones must be the same measurement, ie convert them both to the same. So if the oestrogen was done in pg/ml which is normal, but the progesterone was ng/ml which is normal, multiply the progesterone result by 1000 to reduce it to pg/ml. The ratio should be over 300:1, progesterone to oestrogen, although I've found 600:1 is better still. I don't believe you are getting anywhere near enough progesterone if you are using 0.5ml of cream once a day. Because this low dose is merely stimulating oestrogen and will continue to do so. Progesterone should always be used twice a day too, as levels drop after about 13hrs. The amount should be between 100-200mg/day for best results. But before you increase it please see this page on Oestrogen Dominance. You might like to read this page on How to use progesterone cream. I don't know why you've been given testosterone, unless your doctor thought the results warranted it or to increase your libido. But there's evidence it's not testosterone which increases libido, but progesterone, please see here. I don't know how they measured it either, or whether it was serum or saliva, levels for saliva for women over 30 are 16?47 pg/ml or 0.56-1.65 nmol/L and blood are 30 - 95 ng/dL or 1.041 - 3.297 nmol/L. Take care Wray
Aug 26, 2010
 Progesterone & hormonal seizures
by: Wray

Hi Lisa I'm pleased the progesterone has helped you, it does help catamenial seizures. Please see Please see here. And here. And here. You might like to read our page on Peri-menopause. Take care Wray
Aug 26, 2010
 Thinking about starting natural progesterone
by: Wray

Hi there Progesterone does initially stimulate oestrogen, for more info please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. It's very difficult to judge how long it will take to pass. What I have found is the higher the endogenous oestrogen, the worse the symptoms. The only way to overcome it is with a high amount of progesterone, as it's essential for this to become dominant. Quickly too, otherwise adverse symptoms linger for far too long. I generally recommend 100-200mg/day, but in your case the higher amount would be better. It might be you need more, but only you can judge that. To give you an idea of it's safety and the high amounts needed, hot flushes stop or are dramatically reduced with 400mg/day for 4-5 days. Severe, heavy bleeding needs 400-600mg/day before it stops. As you have many adverse symptoms I suggest you try 200mg/day to begin with, if your symptoms get worse increase to 300mg/day etc. I also suggest you split the amount and use it hourly, as this keeps the level topped up. I'm not sure of your age, but it appears you could be going through peri-menopause. For more info please see our page on Peri-menopause. If I'm right, then it will be impossible to follow your cycle. You say they are irregular too, which is always the case in P-M. If this is the true I suggest you use the cream daily, through your periods too. These will come and go when they wish. Once your symptoms have abated you can slowly reduce the amount you're using till you find the optimum. Please remember stress drops progesterone levels, so more is always needed during a stressful time. There are many nutrients which help with depression, insomnia etc, please see our page on Anxiety. Progesterone can help as it raises levels of serotonin, but I don't think it will be sufficient. Although if you use a high amount it might be all you need. Take care Wray
Aug 26, 2010
 This is a bunch of Crock!
by: Wray

Hi there If you care to read the papers on progesterone, you'll find many on Google Scholar, and not web sites, you might find that the amounts I suggest are all within normal range. I would also point out that over half the questions on this site are from women using other products. I am happy to answer their queries too. The following paper is from June 2010, 2 months ago, and the amount used was 300mg. Please see here. Take care Wray
Aug 27, 2010
 Estrogen requirements
by: Betsy

I am on Vivelle Dot .0325, and a transdermal progesterone, 150mg per day. I was on Prometrium, 100mg per day, but wanted to switch to a natural cream. I am having difficulty adjusting to the cream, but I am willing to give it a chance, based on the information provided here. My question is about estrogen. I am aware that the Vivelle Dot has no estradiol, but I am curious if I need to be on estrogen at all, or can I just take the progesterone? The symptoms that caused me to speak to my doctor about hormones were: Hot flashes at night precipitated by anxiey, racing heart rate, aching joints, lethargy. My periods were not occuring every month, and still only come once in a while. I am 53, but have taken very good care of myself. I have gained a few pounds since taking the hormones, but it is not unmanagable. My hair is falling out though...more than normal...tons of hair loss and that is scaring me. That started about 4 months after starting the hormones. Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you.
Aug 27, 2010
 How long do you continue using natural progesterone
by: Anonymous

I have just started using natural progesterone cream (20mg a day). Within a half an hour my asthma systems and chest discomfort abated. I was in disbelief. I have continued to use it and have been system free ever since (less than 2 months). I am peri-menopausal, and have always had regular periods. Had night sweats since I was 36 but didn't think much about it. I can not believe how great I feel. In the past 5 days I have been able to ride my bike a total of 56 miles, run 12 miles and hike 8. A perfect week as far as I am concerned & not bad for 52 years old. What I haven't been able to figure out from books or the web is how long I will need to continue using progesterone. From what I've read through menopause, (which my mother reached at 56 and I appear to be following that track) when will I know it is time to stop using it?
Aug 30, 2010
 Estrogen requirements
by: Wray

Hi Betsy Vivelle does contains oestradiol and only oestradiol! Please see here. I don't believe anyone needs extra oestrogen in any form, for more info on it's adverse side affects please see our page on HRT. For more info on endocrine disruptors please see the website Our Stolen Future. We all get far too much oestrogen, it's in our food, water, air and the skin care we use. Oestrogen is a known initiator of inflammation, hence your aching joints, please see here and
here. Hot flushes are reduced dramatically or stop on 400mg/day progesterone if used for 4-5 days. Oestrogen does cause a racing heart as it prolongs the QT interval, this starts up tachycardia and arrythmias. Please see here, here, here and here. The racing heart and anxiety if at night only, could be caused by a drop in blood glucose. Avoid all carbs at night, no grains in any form, no legumes, no dairy, and no sugar or anything that contains it. If blood glucose drops too low overnight, a message is sent to the adrenals to make adrenaline, this prompts the liver to release glycogen our stored glucose. But adrenaline causes the heart to beat too fast plus causing anxiety, please see our page on Anxiety. Please see our page on Peri-menopause, it's such a difficult time. The weight gain is due to oestrogen, plus being in peri-menopause with it's dropping progesterone levels. Oestrogen causes Insulin Resistance, please look through the page for more info on it. As you are not ovulating every month, your ovaries are making mainly oestrogen and testosterone, the latter is causing the hair loss. Progesterone suppresses it. Consider taking 2000mg/day N-acetyl cysteine, 2000mg/day inositol and 2-3mg/day biotin. Take care Wray
Aug 30, 2010
 How long do you continue using natural progesterone
by: Wray

Hi there I'm so pleased the progesterone helped the asthma, but I'm amazed the 20mg helped, it usually has to be much higher. It is a vasodilator and an anti-inflammatory too which is why, please see here and here. It's entirely up to you when you stop, I for one never will! It's very helpful for ageing, for the skin, atherosclerosis, nerve degeneration, even Alzheimer's. Please see here, here, here and here. Take care Wray
Sep 15, 2010
 Why Creams
by: Anonymous

why is everybody using Creams or injections if they give you such side effects - My Holistic Doctor gave it to me in a 100MG Pill form which also helps you sleep in that form because it passes thru the Kidney and it's to help with dryness she has it done from a compound pharmacy so that it's made Just For Me and My needs , I had light headache at 1st and now a little depression but after reading this site I now know what the pharmacy meant when they said it will take 3 months to take affect, so I'm glad I found this site I now will wait before making up my mind as to if it will work - but I am already getting better sleep - slowly but surely, by month 3 I should be doing pretty good - I would think those who are Not working out DAILY might have more problems also with some of the effect, there really is no way around that - you MUST work out NO EXCUSES - or don't complain so much - your choice - we all have the same 24 hours in the day. People run Country's and Still work out, and my day is not at all like running a Country or city or state, however the depression can get in the way of that - but try and push thru it on the days that you can - you will not believe the difference it will make.
Sep 22, 2010
 Help
by: dry cough

I had a total hysterectomy 1 year ago which sent me into menopause instantly. I had 10 pounds of fibroids removed. My doctor put me on 20mg of estrdiol which I took for 9 mths. worked for a while then discovered I was estrogen dominant which was why I had fibroids, Started on 30mg of natural progesterone cream 3 months ago and weaned of estradiol. I have been eating healthy going to the gym 3 days a week and have gained 10 pounds and lot of weight around my stomach.My hot flashes have returned and not sleeping well. I also have a dry cough for the past month. Heard this was from to much progesterone. Im so confused. should I increase to 100mg a day or use a small of dose estradiol with the cream.
Sep 28, 2010
 Miracle drug
by: Ness

Natural bio-identical progesterone changed my life. I suffered from very serious and crippling PMS all my life which I now believe was due to very low progesterone levels. During menopause I was put on commercial hrt and developed severe estrogen dominance. When I was taken off that and given natural progesterone I started to get better. To me it's a miracle drug and without it I would be unable to function. As far as I know I have no side effects other than feeling euphoric and calm. If I had had it 30 years earlier, my life would not have been such a struggle.
Oct 02, 2010
 Age 60--bio-identical cyclical HRT
by: Maryanne

Hi, Thank-you for this web site. It addresses something that I suspected was happening but couldn't find expert support for. I use a prescribed estrogen creme twice daily and take a 100 mg of sub-lingual progesterone tablet twice daily days 1-14. I also receive testosterone pellets every 5 months which is another story for another time. On the first day of progesterone, my mood drops to depression, I alienate myself from my family and friends and feel angry. Two days ago, I was happy and well adjusted. Today, I don't want to get out of bed. Until I found this web site, I wondered if I had bipolar disorder. Now it appears that there is evidence that I am experiencing oestrogen dominance?? (I haven't noticed any physical symptoms. I'm a runner, practice yoga and last weekend did a 90 mile cycling tour.) I will pay close attention this week to see if the emotional symptoms improve as I continue with the progesterone. My questions are..1) what can I do to alleviate these initial symptoms? 2) why doesn't my bio-identical HRT prescribing OB-GYN know how to help me with this? 3) where can I find a doctor who is qualified to help in this area? and finally 4)who is Wray and what is your professional background and experience in this matter? Thanks for your help. You're a lifesaver.
Oct 06, 2010
 A test..
by: Anonymous

Interesting topic. Most of the posts mention that they are a week or a day into using the products, and it reminds me of many medications (like the SSRI drugs) that take 4-6 weeks to balance out in the body. Sounds like other people who disagree with the product also did not use the product as Wray has suggested. It would be interesting to see if 4 or 5 of the people who are just starting work with Wray and document their experience it would be helpful to see someone attempt to follow those guidelines and see how many get through those symptoms..
Oct 06, 2010
 Why Creams
by: Wray

Hi there Progesterone comes in many delivery systems, you might like to read more about it on our page Progesterone application methods. Injections are painful, so not an option for every day use. They are generally recommended for recurrent miscarriages and IVF treatment. In actual fact the cream is equally as effective for these problems. The other advantage to the cream above all other systems it can be applied anywhere. Directly on aches and pains, in a sore or dry vagina, on piles, burns, on the neck for a headache/migraine, on the tummy for period cramps etc. Unfortunately oral progesterone is the least effective delivery system, most of it being destroyed by the gut and then further metabolised by the liver. Often leaving only 10-20% for use. Progesterone is good for sleep, I'm pleased it's helped you, please see here, here and here. For more info on creams please see this page we have on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Oct 07, 2010
 Help by: dry cough
by: Wray

Hi there The oestradiol would have helped initially, as oestrogen stimulates progesterone, making this the dominant hormone for only a short while. But once the oestrogen builds up the good effect goes. Unfortunately the converse is also true, when using progesterone it stimulates oestrogen, hence your adverse symptoms. For more info on this please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. I'm surprised you were given oestrogen at all, as it does stimulate fibroids as it's a mitogen. For more info please see our page on Fibroids. In fact it stimulates all hormonally sensitive cells, including fat cells. Unfortunately fat cells are a non-ovarian source of oestrogen, so a vicious cycle starts. The amount of progesterone you are using is far too low, it will merely keep stimulating oestrogen, it will never become dominant which it needs to do before you feel well. You were evidently full of oestrogen, hence the fibroids, so will need at least 100mg/day, if not more to help suppress it. I generally recommend between 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms. I've found hot flushes need about 400mg/day for 4-5 days for them to be reduced or go altogether. Once they've been helped the amount can be reduced slowly, you'll soon realise if the reduction is too fast, so just increase it again. As you are now in menopause please see our page on this here. It gives advice on how much cream to use and when to use it. Interestingly there appears to be a striking gender difference in coughing, on average 50% more women cough than men. One study found a slight increase in coughing on taking an OC or HRT. Both these make me suspect oestrogen. See here, here and here. Coughing is a voluntary or involuntary spasm usually to remove some foreign object or mucus. But oestrogen increases smooth muscle tone, leading to constriction, which could cause one to cough to clear it. Progesterone relaxes muscles by blocking calcium channels, extracellular Ca2+ is normally required for cells to contract, ie to go into spasm. I would suspect the cough is being caused by the oestrogen which is still dominant. Take care Wray
Oct 07, 2010
 Miracle drug
by: Wray

Hi Ness My views entirely! I wish I'd known about it during puberty when I had depression. Looking back I realise now it was just unbalanced hormones. I needed it after having my daughter, when I suffered from PND for 4 years, and could have done with it during peri-menopause too. I only found it 4 years before menopause. In fact I put my daughter on it at 14, not wanting her to have the depression I had. She still uses it and is now 29. It calmed me down no end, I was always on edge. Thanks for sharing your experience with it. Take care Wray
Oct 07, 2010
 Age 60--bio-identical cyclical HRT
by: Wray

Hi Maryanne Thanks for the kind words. You ask who I am and my background. I'm not a professional and my experience comes from life and an insatiable curiosity on how things work, more here. Yes you are experiencing oestrogen dominance, not only are you making oestrogen, but you're supplementing too. And the small amount of progesterone you are getting is merely revving up the oestrogen. For more info please see Oestrogen Dominance. Oral progesterone is not the best delivery system. The progesterone in lozenges/tablets/drops which have to be held in the mouth, is absorbed well. But there's evidence up to 50% is swallowed, for more info please see Progesterone application methods. A progesterone deficiency can manifest as physical symptoms, but when first using it, or combining it as you are with oestrogen, it normally presents as emotional disturbances. I'm puzzled why you are only using it days 1-14 and not daily, whereas the oestrogen you do use daily. Neither of these follow a 'normal' cycle, if that's what your doctor is trying to do, see here for a Graph.

For more info on menopause please see Menopause. I don't believe any woman needs extra oestrogen, in any form, including 'bio-identical'. We get far too much from the oestrogen mimics in our environment, please see this excellent web site Our Stolen Future. For more info on oestrogen please see our page on HRT. As for testosterone, I hold the same opinion. It's often given in the mistaken belief it increases libido. We have many men using progesterone for just that, having tried testosterone and finding it doesn't help. There is evidence it's progesterone that increases libido, please see here. Most doctors are under the impression we need extra oestrogen, very few prescribe progesterone too, so you are lucky in that respect. But you will continue to be prescribed oestrogen, unless you stop it. There are very few doctors who prescribe only progesterone, only one I know of in California, see here. Interesting you say you feel angry, another oestrogen problem, see here. Take care Wray
Oct 25, 2010
 Progesterone Cream
by: Menopause Lady

I use Progestra care. The package says 20mg of natural progesterone usp. Then the following line says formulated to contain 480mg of progesterone per ounce. Not sure how to understand this. I use one 20mg twice a day and felt irritated and experienced a tight feeling in the head or band around the head. Should I increase? Am I taking 20mg or 480mg?
Oct 28, 2010
 Help - Dizziness, balance and coordination issues
by: NYC

I love progesterone but in the last week have experienced severe balance and coordination issues. Had experienced them before, over the last couple years but always very minor. Yesterday, it was so bad i had to go home. I realize progesterone must be taken with estrogen but what are my options? Note, i take 100 mg prometrium per day, .075 mg vivelle dot. I am 47 and have been in menopause for approx. 5 years.
Oct 29, 2010
 Progesterone Cream
by: Wray

Hi there If you are using 20mg twice a day, it means you are getting 40mg/day. The 480mg refers to the amount in each ounce, so unless you use an ounce a day, you will not be getting 480mg. If your container is a standard 2oz, 480mg would use up 1/2 the container, so it would only last you 2 days! I don't believe the 40mg is any where near enough, I recommend between 100-200mg/day. The symptoms you are experiencing are caused by progesterone stimulating oestrogen. This often occurs when first using progesterone, and almost always if a low amount is used. For more info please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. Please read this page we have for more info on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Oct 29, 2010
 2nd month
by: jennifer

I am on my 2nd cycle using about 200/day during my leutal phase. Began using to try and help lengthen my lp as it was only 11 days long. I am 33 years old and desperately trying to conceive without too much medical interference. I believe my 5 year use of the norplant has affected my hormones somehow. I am currently experiencing symptoms that mimic pregnancy which can he very frustrating for a tyc'error :) my symptoms are dull headache' mild nausea, constipation, heartburn, irritability, crying, one instance of spotting a week before my period is due and a cough that just won't quit. I'm not sure how many of these ex are related but I'm going to continue using p cream in hopes of success. Any comments appreciated.
Oct 30, 2010
 Help - Dizziness, balance and coordination issues
by: Wray

Hi there I'm not sure who told you progesterone must be taken with oestrogen, as that's not true. The reverse is, as oestrogen can cause cancer and various other inflammatory diseases if in excess. Please see our page on HRT for more info. Oestrogen also causes water retention, which is why I believe you have balance and coordination problems. Excess water is being retained in the inner ear. I don't think anyone needs extra oestrogen, we have far too much as it is, in our food, water, air and the skin care we use. Please see this excellent website Our Stolen Future for more info on oestrogen mimics. You say you take prometrium, so I'm assuming it's oral progesterone, as it does come in suppository form. Oral progesterone is the least affective delivery system, for more info please see our page on Progesterone application methods. It would be more affective if you used the caps as suppositories. If you do, you should read our page on Oestrogen Dominance first, as this can occur when increasing the absorption of progesterone. You might like to read our page on Menopause too. It will hopefully shed more light on what's occurring. Take care Wray
Oct 31, 2010
 2nd month
by: Wray

Hi Jennifer I've found many women have difficulties after using a contraceptive, for more info please see our page on Contraceptives. And these papers here, here and here. The symptoms you are experiencing now are due to excess oestrogen, for more info please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. I'm pleased you're using 200mg/day, but you might have to increase it to overcome these symptoms quickly. Your ovaries are in need of help, often the cause behind anovulation is oxidative stress. I'm not sure where you live, but a lack of vitamin D causes oxidative stress to the ovaries which results in them malfunctioning, it's essential to have a test done. For more info please see the Vitamin D council website. Contraceptives are designed to stop ovulation, but can result in temporary infertility after stopping them. Once stopped the ovaries can start up again. Initially they make oestrogen and testosterone, but it can be many cycles later before ovulation starts. If too high a level of oestrogen and testosterone are produced, this causes a severe imbalance in the ovaries and anovulation results. Supplementing with progesterone suppresses the excess oestrogen and testosterone, and helps regulate the cycle. Please consider taking the following nutrients too, these are needed by the developing foetus. As they are all antioxidants they should help the ovaries too, taurine see here, here and here. Vitamin D, see here, here, here and here. And Omega 3, see here. Finally please see our page on Pregnancy. Take care Wray
Nov 06, 2010
 Too much progesterone or not enough???
by: Anonymous

The most recent results from my spit test indicate 0.7 pg (estridiol); progesterone at 74347 pg/ml;testerone at 51 pg/ml; dhea at 18.2 ng/ml and cortisol at 6.9 ng/ml. The indicators say my progesterone is very high. I've been taking a 4% cream (40 MG/GM)once a day plus 5 100 MG capsules daily to help me sleep. I don't have much energy but I continue to lift weights daily and run at least 3 miles (with great difficulty because I'm always out of breath) and even though I'm working out and watching what I eat I can't lose a single pound. I wonder if it's because the progesterone is too high? (I'm not taking any estrogen supplementation).
Nov 10, 2010
 Too much progesterone or not enough???
by: Wray

Hi there Your progesterone is on the high side, although it can reach 100,000 pg/ml, please see here. Progesterone can aid with sleep, but I believe it would be advisable to stop the capsules and use only the cream. Oral progesterone is not the best delivery system, it does have to be a high dose for it to have much affect, see Progesterone application methods.
You are currently taking 500mg/day, but the liver is taking a strain as it has to metabolise it, topical progesterone by passes the liver. Please consider switching to cream only, you might find you only need about 200mg/day or less. This would require 5ml (1tsp) of the 4% cream you are currently using. Progesterone is excellent for the lungs as it's a bronchodilator, which increases air volume and flow, it's been used successfully in asthma cases. I can only assume your breathing difficulties must have something to do with the liver metabolism. I'm not sure of your age, but it could be you have developed IR, please see our page on Insulin Resistance. This might explain the inability to loose weight. Progesterone is thermogenic, speeding metabolism slightly, so this normally aids in weight loss. Please consider having a vitamin D test done. A low level has a bearing on weight, for more info see the Vitamin D council website.
Take care Wray
Nov 15, 2010
 Moods and sluggish thyroid
by: Anonymous

Hi! I'm thinking of trying a natural progesterone cream mostly for moods. I don't know if i'm on the right track. I have kind of regular periods, I don't have much of pms. My problems are more related to mood, depression, anxiety, insomnia and cold hands and feets, sluggish thyroid.

Ok, I know I'm guessing a lot, but I think a natural treatment used with care won't do harm, and I will notice if it is doing good or not. So, here're my questions...

My thinking about estrogen is that it's probably normal/low, (high in ratio to progesterone though), is that probable? If that's the case, could a low dose progesterone (20mg) be sufficient? Will the two weeks of using the cream give result in the other two weeks, will it balance up the whole body for the whole month? Thanks!
Nov 15, 2010
 Too Much Progesterone or not enough??
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray: God Bless You for taking the time to provide this information and this site. You said that I might be Insulin Resistant. What kind of symptoms would indicate that? What would I do if I were insulin resistant?

At your suggestion, I have cut way back on the progesterone (approx. 1/4 tsp.of the cream daily - measured in the plastic spoon) but now I'm having hot flashes; have no energy and am not able to sleep (I've also gained 5 lbs!!) Help! Is there ever any solution to what at times seems like madness trying to figure this out?
Nov 15, 2010
 How to stop progesterone side effects?
by: Anonymous

I took 500 mg progesterone in the past for 47 days and was severely depressed & fatigued & stopped it. I was using .25mg bioidentical estrial/ testosterone cream at the time & added .25mg in a face cream. Subsequently stopped the face cream & progesterone.

Now several years later (age 55) with a new GYN & severe vulvadynia I've upped my bio estrial/test to 1 mg. He is insisting on the bio progestorone 500mg to start. 1 week on it, depression & fatigue, dead weight legs & increase in appetite. I've fought the depression up to now 2 1/2 wk. But I fear the same pattern of it continuing to get worse. I have many other health problems I battle each day & need my sanity to do it. He says there is nothing I can do for side effects. Is there ? or is there a time period I can hope to get through before it gets better? Will it eventially level out or will I remain in permanent PMS by taking it?
Nov 16, 2010
 Progesterone side effects
by: holly

I just gave this last question. I need to correct my dosage. Its 50mg, not 500 mg. My dr wants it up to 100 mg. I'm switching to the cream now. I don't know how long I can take this. Its making my vulvodynia flare even worse! Hope the dr here answers this!
Nov 17, 2010
 Moods and sluggish thyroid
by: Wray

Hi there Progesterone can help with moods, it has mild sedative and calming actions, due to activating the GABA receptor sites. GABA is one of our most calming neurotransmitters. See here, here and here. We do have a page on Anxiety, please look through it, as there are nutrients which help too. They also help with insomnia too. Cold hands and feet could be due to high oestrogen, as this makes us colder. Progesterone is thermogenic, ie it increases temps slightly. A lack of the amino acid tyrosine also causes cold hands and feet, are you eating enough protein? Or you could try a tyrosine supplement, start with 500mg/day and increase slowly till you find the optimum level. The thyroid needs tyrosine to make the two thyroid hormones T4 and T3. If tyrosine is lacking the thyroid struggles. A lack of vitamin D affects the thyroid too, please have a test done. For more info please see the Vitamin D council website. 20mg/day progesterone will most probably give you Oestrogen Dominance symptoms, please read through this page. I recommend between 100-200mg/day. Progesterone is only made in the ovaries after ovulation, and is sufficient for the whole month. In a cycling woman with insufficient luteal phase progesterone, supplementing does provide relief. Please see our page on How to use progesterone cream for more info. Take care Wray
Nov 17, 2010
 Too Much Progesterone or not enough??
by: Wray

Hi there Thanks for the kind words! You must have missed the link I gave you for insulin resistance, please look through it. It gives what it is, the symptoms, the possible causes, and what can be done about it. Please see the following link on Insulin Resistance. I asked you to cut back on the capsules, not the cream! I suggested increasing the cream to 200mg/day. You said you were using 40mg/day, but now you say you've cut back to 1/4tsp, which means you are getting 50mg/day. What amount were you using, evidently it was more? The oral progesterone is putting a strain on your liver, 500mg is a large dose, I suggested you stopped this. Please re-read that link on the various delivery systems of progesterone. There are plenty of papers showing the effectiveness of the different systems. Take care Wray
Nov 17, 2010
 How to stop progesterone side effects?
by: Wray

Hi there The reason for the side effects is excess oestrogen, particularly as you are ramping this up with oestrogen. I don't believe anyone needs extra oestrogen, we have too much as it is. It's in our food, water, air and the skin care we use, please see the website Our Stolen Future. Progesterone initially stimulates the oestrogen receptors, it's only when it becomes the dominant hormone do things settle down. But by using the oestrogen cream it will have great difficulty doing this, even if it is oestriol, it's still an oestrogen. Please see Oestrogen Dominance for more info. Adding in testosterone means it has to work harder to suppress that too, I don't believe any women needs more of this hormone either. 500mg/day progesterone is a large dose, especially as it's oral. This is the least effective means of delivery, most getting destroyed in the gut and liver. It will also put a strain on the liver, as it has to metabolise it. For more info please see Progesterone application methods. You say you have other health problems you battle with, they could well be caused by the oestrogen and testosterone you are using. When did they start? The dead weight legs sounds like myopathy to me, if it is progesterone is excellent for this. The increased appetite is due to oestrogen again, it disturbs blood glucose, whereas progesterone stabilises it. The same with the fatigue and depression, progesterone raises levels of serotonin and dopamine slightly, so can help with depression. Progesterone is an excellent anti-inflammatory. In fact it is so good it's now being used via IV transfusion for brain trauma victims to prevent the inflammation and oedema that occur. I would suggest switching to a cream and using that in your vagina and surrounds. It's essential to make progesterone the dominant hormone, but this will be very difficult when using oestrogen too. Take care Wray
Nov 21, 2010
 I commented here a while back
by: Tiara

I regret to say that anyone reading a message list such as this and not getting true professional assistance is at risk of very unpleasant effects. I know, I did so. I lived in areas without local access to doctors who used bioidentical hormones. I read Dr. Lee's books, got on chat lists discussing natural hormones and bought into the idea that progesterone alone was a silver bullet that would fix everything. I did a saliva test first and it showed that at that time I was somewhat low in estrogen, relatively lower in progesterone and fairly good with testosterone. That was 8 years ago. Over the counter bioidentical progesterone helped for about 7-8 months but then I showed symptoms of excess. Groggy sluggish sleeping excessively.

I stopped and in a week or so felt much better. I learned I could use a small amount if feeling edgy once a week or so but more than that and I felt as if I was on a sedative.
I had another saliva test a couple of years later. This one showed estrogen a bit low, progesterone ok and testosterone fairly good. Small amounts of OTC estriol helped used 2-3 times a week. Still couldn't tolerate progesterone. A year ago I showed some symptoms of low estrogen and low progesterone believing the hype that using progesterone is enough to restore everything I used the maximum dose twice a day for several months. It snuck up on me again. Exhausted, low blood pressure, foggy, and now starting to show significant low estrogen symptoms including very dry eyes, nose and mouth, hot flashes I'd never had before and increasing brain fog. I traveled for a few days and forgot the cream. I started to feel better and it finally dawned on my now reawakening brain that the progesterone was making me worse. It took well over a week to clear my body enough to start to feel good.

6 months ago I did find a local practitioner working with bioidentical hormones. Had more saliva testing done. Progesterone way too high, estrogen lowest of any test and testosterone lower. Several months on 60/40 biest, estradiol/estriol had me feeling much better but I started to droop in energy. No brain fog, libido better but no drive to accomplish things or desire for exercise. Was retested and found estrogen ok, progesterone ok but testosterone had dropped to half of the last test. I found out that using progesterone can lower estrogen and testosterone in some women depending on how it converts and estrogen and testosterone can both affect the other hormones. Like a car, all the tires need to be filled to the right air pressure. All hormones need to be at optimum levels for YOU! I also found out that there are quite a few specialists who can work long distance with lab work and legitimate mail order pharmacies. tahomaclinic.com is one and womensinternational.com. Save yourself a lot of lost time and well being, find real help. Don't do what I did.
Nov 22, 2010
 please help me
by: Anonymous

I bought progesterone cream couple days ago. I tried it right away in the store about teaspoon of cream 1,3 g. I felt a little wierd and had chills for half an hour and I felt great all night long, felt like brand new person with ton of energy, great mood and sexy. Next morning I woke up refreshed and could not wait to apply it again, I used less as it says 1/8 of teaspoon. I started feeling weird right away: my heart was racing, while I was driving I almost ran into several cars, when I stopped I thought I parked my car, but I did not so I was rolling away and did not realize I was moving, when my husband saw me, he said that I looked like I am about to collapse and die. Day Third: did not apply any today, but I still feel high, it screrws with my judgement, vision, I also have dilated pupils, I feel tired, my eyes hurt. I am scared to apply it again, because it is definitely not normal what I have experienced. I hope there is solution to balance my estrogen.
Nov 22, 2010
 Do No Harm
by: Anonymous

What kind of snake oil claims are you making on this site? I would like to see your credentials, "Wray". To tell women that larger and larger amounts of progesterone cream will help anything is not only a lie, but also physically and emotionally harmful.

I bought into the hype and used 200 mgs of progesterone cream to help what my ob-gyn thought was endometriosis. It turned out I have vulvodynia/vulvar vestibulitis. Using progesterone cream made the pain so much worse. When I tried to get off the cream, I had something akin to a nervous breakdown. Why? Because progesterone is a potent anti-anxiety medication which acts on the GABA receptors in the brain. Cutting it out means going cold turkey from this anti-anxiety effect.

There is no case in nature where a woman's body in its non-pregnant state needs thousands of mgs. of progesterone. It will down regulate estrogen receptor sites, blunt testosterone effect, and increase cortisol, not to mention cause weight gain b/c of increased hunger and worsening insulin resistance.

You operate under the guise of helping women, but really who are you helping? Do you work for a company that sells progesterone cream? Judging by the fine print on this page, it would appear you DO.

Beware ladies. There IS such a thing as too much of anything.
Nov 25, 2010
 I commented here a while back
by: Wray

Hi Tiara Progesterone can have sedative properties, but the amount has to be high. I doubt if you were using enough, and it's more likely your symptoms were caused by excess oestrogen in ratio to progesterone. When first using progesterone it stimulates oestrogen, so adverse symptoms can be experienced, see this page we have for more info on Oestrogen Dominance. The symptoms you describe are all related to excess oestrogen. The very dry eyes, nose and mouth are a sign of high oestrogen, low progesterone. It's called Sjogren's syndrome, see here. As you are now using biest, please see our page on HRT. No one knows what causes hot flushes, but progesterone can stop them, or reduce them dramatically, see here. You would feel good when stopping the progesterone, as the stimulating affect it had on oestrogen was stopped. The amount you were using was probably the normal recommended 20-40mg/day which can cause problems. I recommend 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms, this is still half the amount we make when pregnant. See our page on How to use progesterone. Incidentally we have many men using progesterone to increase their libido. In fact there's evidence it's progesterone that's responsible for this, and not testosterone, see here. You might like to see what one doctor said in response to a query, see here. Take care Wray
Nov 25, 2010
 please help me
by: Wray

Hi there I'm not sure of the strength of the cream you have. But judging by the recommended amount of 1/8th tsp, this probably gave you the standard 20mg/day progesterone. Using a full teaspoon gave you about 160mg progesterone. This is within the range I recommend, which is between 100-200mg/day. For more info please see our page on How to use progesterone cream. The weird feeling and chills was caused by initially stimulating oestrogen. This hormone reduces body temperature. But the high amount of progesterone overcame this initial boost of oestrogen, hence feeling great etc. For more info please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. Dropping the amount to the 1/8th tsp would ramp up this effect of excess oestrogen, as the progesterone became too low. Oestrogen causes prolongation of the QT interval, which results in palpitations, arrhythmia and Torsades de Pointes. Whereas progesterone shortens the QT interval, thus calming the heart, see here and
here and here. You might like to read this page on how increasing the amount of progesterone can help, see here. Take care Wray
Nov 25, 2010
 What part of too much progesterone is bad for me and others do you not understand?
by: Tiara

Are you a schooled, licensed physician? Do you have any training and credentials by a legitimate educational facility such as nursing school, medical school or perhaps even as a nutritionist?
I have done medically sound saliva testing with experienced laboratories and had a nurse pratictioner, a primary care physician who works with bioidentical hormones and saliva testing and a doctor who is a psychiatrist, has done obstetrics, is a woman herself who went into specialized care of hormones and health with training from the nationwide group body logic mds who put together nutrition, exercise and hormone balancing. All 3 said get off the progesterone and my dose was NOT THAT HIGH, it was quite low, as your body doesn't metabolize it in the same way as many women do.
But NOOO! you know SOOO much more than they do and most of all how my body responds. All sarcasm intended just in case anyone had a doubt.
There is a slight chance you are a well intended fool. I'll lay long odds however that you are deliberately ignoring sound medical practice such as saliva or urine testing of hormones AND symptomatic checks of personal response to bioidentical hormone treatment in order to make money from selling progesterone only.
I am a very strong believer in Karma and you are gaining a whole lot of very heavy painful Karma. When it catches up with you, it's going to hurt.
Ladies, the only good thing you'll read here is advice telling you to get yourself tested by a certified lab for hormones, estrogen, progesterone, testosterone, DHEA and cortisol, thyroid and Vit. D are good also. And also to have those tests evaluated by experienced medical practitioners. Not this snake oil internet guru.
Progesterone can help if you are low in it. And your levels can change depending on stress and other factors. What was once enough may become too much or not enough and you may need more or less of estrogen and which estrogen, estradiol, estriol or estrone and testosterone or dhea.
go away from this site and don't come back.
Nov 26, 2010
 Do No Harm
by: Wray

Hi there I'm not making any snake oil claims, everything I say on this site is backed by research studies done with progesterone. I always give the link to the papers so people can verify it themselves. I'm not forcing any progesterone on them. Yes we do have a cream, but I help all men and women, irrespective of the form of progesterone they use, or the brand. About 75% of the queries we get are from people using other brands. I've no idea what brand of cream you used, the inflammation could have been caused by the other ingredients in it. The pH of creams is generally acid, this would cause stinging and inflammation on initial use. When first using progesterone it stimulates oestrogen, this is an inflammatory hormone. I never advise going cold turkey off progesterone, as it does cause a bad reaction, I always advise reducing slowly. I suggest between 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms, not thousands as you say. There are an overwhelming number of oestrogen mimics we now have to contend with. So although we're not pregnant, when large amounts of progesterone are needed, we need something safe to counter the affect of these mimics. For more on EDC's please see Our Stolen Future. I believe the progesterone would have helped you, once the initial inflammatory phase had passed. Progesterone itself is a potent anti-inflammatory, it's given in amounts over 1200mg/day to brain trauma victims to prevent the inflammation that occurs. VVS is associated with a number of causes, one is peripheral neuropathy. Progesterone is known to regenerate nerves, see here. Another is candida, progesterone reverses the inflammatory oestrogen response, see here. Mast cells are also implicated, progesterone has an inhibitory affect, see here. Significantly higher levels of TNF-alpha are found in women with VVS, progesterone inhibits TNF-alpha, see here and here. In the USA 61% of chronic pain patients are women, starting at menarche and decreasing at menopause. This suggests an hormonal imbalance, symptoms of VVS increase at mid-cycle and at menses, when the oestrogen to progesterone ratio is high. Take care Wray
Nov 30, 2010
 scared to death
by: Anonymous

I am a 40 year old woman that has always had irregular periods, difficulty getting pregnant and have had anxiety periodically in my life. After finding a Dr. specializing in bioidentical homones and being tested low for progesterone, and high in cortisol I have been taking a progesterone cream in the evening (37.5mg) for almost a year. I am also on a low dose of DHEA for the same reasons 1.25mg 2 times per day. Last month I had a terrible feeling of depression on day 18 of my cycle. I went back to the Dr. who then upped my dose of progesterone to 4x the amount. I reduced the DHEA to one dose per day and increased the progesterone to the reccommended amount. One week after starting the higher dose of p. I started experiencing huge mood swings.
Nov 30, 2010
 scared to death continued
by: Anonymous

I felt as though I was bi polar, the depression so great and the next while such feelings of euphoria. When that passed it left me with a great depressed feeling (suicidal at times) with horrible thoughts and a very weak physcological state. This all lasted from the week after I started the p. until the end of my period which was a total of two weeks. I'm off to my Dr tomorrow to see what see makes of all of this. I have been through bad anxiety in my life but this depression was the worst thing I have ever experienced and I wonder how it relates to the hormone therapy.
Dec 04, 2010
 Too much progesterone or no enough?
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray: I asked you about my progesterone level back on Nov. 15. You said I may be insulin resistant so I read the sites you suggested. However, I can't determine from those sites if I really am insulin resistant or if I should just be taking the supplement recommended there. Also, I HAVE significantly reduced the amount of progesterone I'm taking to 1/2 tsp. of a 4% cream once a day at bedtime (I still don't know how to figure out if that's enough or too much). I've gained about 8lbs in the last month since I've reduced the amount of progesterone. Do you have any idea what adjustments I should make now to the progesterone so I stop gaining and start losing the weight? Thank you for your help.
Dec 05, 2010
 What part of too much progesterone is bad for me and others do you not understand?
by: Wray

Hi Tiara As I said it my last reply to you, I advise all people who write it in. Over 75% are on other brands of progesterone, many given it by their doctors. I never advise someone not to have a test, they are very useful. I do work with other health practitioners, we have a naturopath in the UK who runs all our saliva tests for us. Many doctors and health practitioners use our product, I'm in touch with them too. You'll notice on some of the pages doctors have written in with encouraging words. But most encouraging of all are the women and men who write in saying they have been helped. I give as many research papers as the space allows, nothing I say is not backed by research. As for karma, I had a reading last week and the angels said they were giving me help, what more could I ask! Take care Wray
Dec 05, 2010
 What part of too much progesterone is bad for me and others do you not understand?
by: Wray

Hi Tiara As I said it my last reply to you, I advise all people who write it in. Over 75% are on other brands of progesterone, many given it by their doctors. I never advise someone not to have a test, they are very useful. I do work with other health practitioners, we have a naturopath in the UK who runs all our saliva tests for us. Many doctors and health practitioners use our product, I'm in touch with them too. You'll notice on some of the pages doctors have written in with encouraging words. But most encouraging of all are the women and men who write in saying they have been helped. I give as many research papers as the space allows, nothing I say is not backed by research. As for karma, I had a reading last week and the angels said they were giving me help, what more could I ask! Take care Wray
Dec 05, 2010
 scared to death continued
by: Wray

Hi there again I would hazard a guess you've been deficient in progesterone most of your life, with excess oestrogen. Progesterone has anxiolytic properties, see here, here and here. It could be you initially need a higher amount than the 150mg you are getting to get you over the oestrogen dominance. I'm sure your doctor will be able to help you. You could ask her for a vitamin D test, a low level reduces the benefits of progesterone and causes depression/anxiety, see here and here. For more info please see the Vitamin D council website. Take care Wray
Dec 06, 2010
 PLEASE HELP
by: Anonymous

I started experiencing anxiety, panic attacks and depression in August. This happens a week before I start my period every month since August. My gynecologist told me they don?t know much about PMDD and to take vitamins. I saw a counselor once and she recommended I try natural progesterone. When I purchased it, I didn?t read any side effects, only read good things. I was excited so I put the cream on for the first time last WED. I felt OK. The next day I found this site and stopped putting the cream on. Thursday I developed a dry cough and itchy throat. Friday I devolved full on depression. I had depression the whole weekend. I feel it starting to go away, but not completely. Still have a dry cough and my chest hurts. Can someone please tell me when this will completely be out of my system? It is a horrible horrible cream. Anything ?natural? should not affect anyone like this. Natural things aren?t supposed to give someone depression when they?re trying to fix it.
Dec 10, 2010
 Too much progesterone or no enough?
by: Wray

Hi there Insulin resistance can be checked by lab tests, or you look through the symptoms listed and see if you have any. There is no single test for IR, but the following are often tested??
Blood pressure equal to or higher than 130/85 mmHg
Fasting blood glucose equal to or higher than 100 mg/dL or 5.55 mmol/L
Elevated insulin levels
Elevated CRP
Large waist circumference 35 inches or 87.5cm or more
Low HDL cholesterol Under 50 mg/dL or 1.3 mmol/L
Triglycerides equal to or higher than 150 mg/dL or 1.79 mmol/L
Medline Insulin resistance
Lab Tests Online - Understanding insulin resistance
I actually asked you to consider switching to cream only, as you might find you only need about 200mg/day or less. This would require 5ml (1tsp) of the 4% cream you are currently using. The 500mg/day oral progesterone is putting a strain on your liver. Unless you've stopped that entirely, but you don't say. Please try reducing the oral instead of reducing the cream, I think you'll find it of far greater benefit. The weight gain is due to excess oestrogen, as this causes both water retention and an increase in fat cells. So evidently you are not using enough. Please do consider increasing the cream back up again, and reducing or stopping the oral progesterone. Take care Wray
Dec 13, 2010
 hyper thyroid and progesterone 20 mg
by: Rae

Hello..
I'm 54 and post menopausal..I'd recently (within a year) been diagnosed with a hyper thyroid and have lost all zeal about 2 yrs ago. I take no other medicines. It's almost like having a hand on your head and a fog from the eyebrows up.. Always wanted someone to find out what my hormone make up was on the day before starting my period..and duplicating it....all that energy!

I started ( 10 days ago) using 20 mg progesterone cream in the mornings only. Now my hands hurt to the bone and appear to be swelling a bit, more so the right one.Also VERY tender breasts. I am also concerned about possible effects on my thyroid. I've not had hormone testing done yet. Just want my old "Get up and go" back...Thanks for your input..
Dec 29, 2010
 Ovarian Cysts
by: Barb

Hi, anybody have issues with ovarian cysts? I am scheduled for removal of both ovaries in a few weeks. I am scared of the surgical menapause it will put me in. I am starting on natural progesterone as I have heard this may help. I am in constant pain and it is effecting every part of my life. I really am hoping for good results from this. I think I will postpone if not cancel my surgery to see if I can stop them another way.
Jan 02, 2011
 New to progesterone cream
by: Midge

Hi I am 42 years old, I recently purchased natural progesterone cream after experiencing irregular cycle and late cycle a couple of months ago.

After reading many articles on the benefits of natural progesterone cream I read that it also helps with migraines associated with stress and a woman monthly cycle. For about 9-10 months, I have been suffering from severe migraines which can last up to 4 days each time. These seem to come on either when stressed, during illness and more often with the onset of my monthly cycle. I was prescribed migraine medication which made no difference to the severity of the migraine but which left me tired.

As well as the above, I also suffer greatly with severe pain in the right side of my abdomen under my ribs which was investigated thoroughly many years ago and which found no cause at all and was put down to just one of those pains I have to learn to live with! Also I suffer with intestinal problems such as trapped wind, cramps and constipation on a regular basis.

I have a healthy lifestyle, I do not smoke, rarely drink alcohol, exercise daily, I am a vegetarian so eat well but have recently cut out Soya milk from my diet as I read it can increase oestrogen in the body. I also have a physically demanding job working with autistic children and young adults. My question is would the cream help any of my symptoms at all? I am concerned about using this product after reading some of the posts on this site regarding severe side effects.

Many thanks.
Jan 02, 2011
 Ovarian Cysts
by: Wray

Hi Barb If you can hold on for a bit longer please do. The last thing you need is to go into menopause overnight. You might like to see this site on Hysterectomy. It covers all aspects. I suspect your ovaries are suffering from oxidative stress, in other words free radicals have damaged them and you need antioxidants to reverse this. Have you been subjected to much stress or environmental toxins, both of which can cause this? Although you don't have polycystic ovaries, we do have a page on PCOS. Please read through it, as it explains why cysts occur and how to reverse them. There is also a list of nutrients which help to do this. But please, please have a vitamin D test done, most of us have a low level, and vitamin D is vital to prevent oxidative stress in all cells, including the ovaries. Progesterone certainly helps, as cysts are often a result of low progesterone levels. It is also an anti-inflammatory, so should help the pain you are suffering. I suggest you rub it all over your tummy and back too. Please use it hourly if you feel the need, there is no right or wrong way to use progesterone. But please use enough, I recommend 100-200mg/day, anything less in your case will merely exacerbate the problem. You will probably need the higher amount initially, possibly more. It's very safe, so if you need to increase to 400-600mg/day please do. I've found with the pain of endometriosis 500mg/day is needed, and yours sounds as bad. Please read our page on Oestrogen Dominance if no one has warned you about this. Take care Wray
Jan 02, 2011
 hyper thyroid and progesterone 20 mg
by: Wray

Hi Rae I'm surprised you've lost your zeal and have brain fog and no energy with a 'hyper' thyroid. Normally these people are always on the go, not stopping for a minute. But the symptoms you've given indicate both low progesterone and low vitamin D, especially as you have a problem thyroid. Please have a test done, for more info see the Vitamin D council website. Interestingly a lack of vitamin D reduces the benefits of progesterone. Progesterone rises to a high mid luteal phase, then drops sharply a day or two prior to our period. I can only assume it was this high level which gave you the energy, it is thermogenic, so speeding metabolism slightly. My energy came back and the brain fog lifted once I'd started progesterone. Your response to the cream indicates you lack progesterone, although the symptoms are in fact caused by oestrogen. Very briefly, oestrogen is an inflammatory hormone, it also causes water retention. So the sore breasts and hands, the swelling, all point to excess oestrogen, stimulated further by progesterone. More about this apparent paradox on our Oestrogen Dominance page. I recommend 100-200mg/day, the amount you are using will exacerbate symptoms even more. It should be used a minimum of twice a day, as progesterone levels drop after about 13 hrs. Progesterone has no adverse affect on the thyroid. Please also read our page on Menopause for more info on this stage. Take care Wray
Jan 02, 2011
 PLEASE HELP
by: Wray

Hi there I apologise for not answering earlier, I must have overlooked your query, and then I've been travelling. I'm puzzled why you stopped using the cream once you'd read this site. We advocate the use of progesterone cream. You should have been warned about Oestrogen Dominance before you started it. Please read through this page and you'll see why something natural can cause such an affect. Unfortunately stopping the cream as you did would have exacerbated the symptoms. It's actually not progesterone doing it, but oestrogen. Progesterone is extremely affective for anxiety and panic attacks, please see our page on Anxiety for a full explanation. There are plenty of papers on the page, plus a list of nutrients which help too. The reason your symptoms start a week before your period is dropping progesterone levels. Progesterone is made naturally by the ovaries after ovulation and during the luteal phase. If anovulation occurs, no progesterone is made, so symptoms can either begin or worsen. I'm not sure what age you are, but quite possibly you're in Peri-menopause. This is a difficult time, with dropping progesterone levels, but normal oestrogen levels. The dry cough and sore chest is due to oestrogen, it constricts blood vessels and is a known initiator of inflammation. Progesterone on the other hand is an anti-inflammatory, and vasodilator. It also dilates the bronchioles, so helping the lungs, see here and here. Take care Wray
Jan 03, 2011
 Ovarian Cysts
by: Barb

Hi Wray,
Thank you for your response to my question. I am wondering exactly how much progesterone cream I need to use. You say up to 500 mg. Is this a tsp or 1/2, do you know? I have been having pretty horrible effects. More bloat than normal, not sleeping, jittery, headache and very dry mouth. How long does it take for the progesterone to overide the estrogen? Also, I did not mention that I had a hysterectomy but they left my ovaries so I didn't know when to start the cream ideally. I also had a complete pelvic floor reconstructive surgery so I probably have adhesions and scar tissue. And, should I use this continually without stopping so as to keep the cysts from coming back? Also, I am planning on taking vitamin D 2000 IU and DIM to help my symptoms. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks again, Barb
Jan 06, 2011
 Progesterone has been a life saver for me!
by: Christy

Hi Wray,
natural progesterone has really changed my life. All these people on here could be using creams that do not have the proper levels of progesterone, or worse, creams that are full of soy which causes estrogen dominance. I tried many creams until I found one that worked beautifully. I can sleep after 39 years of shocking insomnia, my heart no longer races like a freight train, no anxiety or rage before my periods, no fear of leaving the house anymore, no blood pressure drops, or unstable blood sugar. I have just started perimenopause, but I still take my prgesterone starting 14 days before my period. The first couple of days I get terible bloating, but then as the cream kicks in it goes away. Should I be using it everyday of the month now that I am in peri? I am finding myself getting grumpy, dizzy and depressed those 14 days that I am off it.
Thanks, Christy From Australia
Jan 07, 2011
 New to progesterone cream
by: Wray

Hi Midge Progesterone can help migraines, especially if associated with the monthly cycle. It should help stress related migraines too, as stress drops progesterone levels. Please see these papers here, here and here. The adverse symptoms you've read about are caused by using too little progesterone. In this instance it merely keeps stimulating oestrogen which is responsible for them. Please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance for a full explanation. Oestrogen can cause bloating, constipation too, as it causes us to retain water, absorbing much of it from the intestines. Progesterone is an excellent diuretic. The cramps could be caused by a lack of taurine, this amino acid is not found in veggies, please consider taking it. Taurine is an osmolyte, it controls the electrolytes going in and out of cells. A lack of these can cause cramps, you are probably eating more than enough, but without taurine they are ineffective. I'm relieved you've stopped the soy milk, in fact cut out all soy foods. For more info see here and here. Please have a vitamin D test done too, a lack of this can cause inflammation. For more info please see the Vitamin D council website.

Interestingly it appears that a lack of vitamin D causes autism, you might like to read more about this here and here. Please use enough progesterone, I recommend 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms. For more info see our page on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Jan 12, 2011
 Ovarian Cysts
by: Wray

Hi Barb I don't know what strength of cream you are using, or what amount you've been prescribed. If it's the standard ±15mg progesterone per g of cream, then you would have to use 6.6 tsp per day to reach 500mg/day. If it's a stronger cream ie double, then approximately 3 tsp per day would be needed. Judging by the increase in symptoms, it would appear you are on a very low amount, ie 20-40mg/day. All those symptoms are indicative of excess oestrogen, and you are now going through Oestrogen Dominance. I'm not suggesting you have to use 500mg/day, but it's something to aim for if the lower amounts don't help. Oestrogen is an inflammatory hormone, plus it causes water retention, hence the headaches and dry mouth. See these papers here, here and here for headache. And this paper here for the dry mouth. Unless enough progesterone is used, it can take 3-6 months, as it did with me. I started it 15 years ago, and used the standard amount of 20mg/day, as I had no one to advise me. As you've had a hyst, there is no need to try to follow any cycle, as you don't have one. Apart from which I've found if symptoms are severe, they come back again when taking a break. For best affect please rub it where you feel pain, ie your tummy and back for the pelvic pain, and your neck and face for headaches and the dry mouth, it's excellent for the face, see here. 2000mg/day vitamin D is far too low, it needs to be a minimum of 5000iu's per day, if not more. Please see the Vitamin D council website for more info. Take care Wray
Jan 12, 2011
 Progesterone has been a life saver for me!
by: Wray

Hi Christy I'm so pleased the progesterone is helping you. I do agree about the amount too, I've found low levels often exacerbate symptoms, rather than helping them. Progesterone is good for sleep, see here. Oestrogen causes tachycardia as it can prolong the QT interval, progesterone reverses this, see here, here, here, here and here. Progesterone also helps Anxiety and aggression. I have found no papers on agoraphobia, but it certainly eliminated mine! And it helps BP and blood glucose too. Peri-menopause is a very difficult time, please read through this page, it explains how to use progesterone. I used it daily during P-M as all my symptoms came back during the break, including during my period. Take care Wray
Jan 19, 2011
 Nose bleeds and natural progesterone
by: Lucy

Has anyone experienced regular nose bleeds while on natural progesterone? I've never had them before but since going onto natural hormones I have them regularly, at night and in the mornings. I decided to stop taking the progesterone to see if it made any difference but retained taking DHEA and the other hormones. I didn't get nose bleeds. However, I am on zocor, which thins the blood. My doctor says there is no relationship - but I think otherwise. Any thoughts?
Jan 21, 2011
 Nose bleeds and natural progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Lucy Progesterone prevents platelets aggregating, plus it reduces thrombin by 10-15%, thus reducing clotting, see here. I think there is quite possibly a connection. Please see here and here too. And this excellent paper here. There are many nutrients which thin blood and reduce cholesterol, apart from progesterone. Omega 3 fish oil is one, niacin (B3), taurine is another, see here, here and here. But the most important is vitamin D, see here. A lack of this causes cholesterol to rise, please consider having a vitamin D test done. For more info see the Vitamin D council website. You mention 'taking' progesterone, if by this you mean oral, it's not the best Delivery system. Please consider stopping the DHEA, it can cause cysts and cancer, see here, here and here. You mention other hormones, if you are also taking oestrogen, this increases oxidative stress, leading to atherosclerosis, see here. And if testosterone, this too, see here, here, here, here here and here. Take care Wray
Jan 28, 2011
 Progesterone
by: Anonymous

The question is; is that ALL you need? In menopause, I found I was low in etriol, the safest estrogen. Both assist in pregnancy, which, by the way, I believe science has found that we are supposed to be pregnant as often as possible. Biological fact to propagate the species. Granted, we aren't supposed to be pregnant our whole lives, but if we fool our bodies into thinking we are younger than we are; isn't that part of the point? We are trying to stay younger longer so we can actually enjoy life!!! Have ALL your hormones checked. It WIll make difference. You have to balance ALL your
hormones, including your thyroid, which is consistantly under diagnosed for women 50 and over. If it comes back normal, have another one using a different method. Make sure you ask your doctor to do that. He/She is YOUR employee! They are educated GUESSERS and you must take control of your own health!! It is never one thing.
Jan 30, 2011
 How much natural progesterone?
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, I have a few questions about using natural progesterone. First, is it true that nat. progesterone (using the cream) can build up in the fat tissue in the body, and therfore cause an overdose in the body, when using larger amounts, like 100-200mg/day? Also, how long does a woman need to stay on high amounts like 100-200mg/day? Also, my daughter is 13 yrs old and has some pms symptoms like pre menstral asthma, dizziness, acne, and I think her blood sugars are iregular before her period, can she use the natural progesterone as well? How much should she start with? Are there any known side effects from nat. progesterone? I also (I am 36 yrs old) have had heart palpitations while being on the cream, I have only been on 100-200mg for about 14 days, before that I was taking about 40mg & also had the heart palpitations. Will this stop now that I am taking higher amounts? Thank you for providing an awesome website for women & for your reply to my questions, God Bless!!
Feb 04, 2011
 Hysterectomy
by: Janet

I had a complete hysterectomy about 20 years ago. I'm 64. I've been on an estrogen patch of .05 for most of those 20 years. Since then I gained 70 pounds, 30 of which I lost about 1 year ago, but can't seem to get rid of the rest. I have fibromyalgia, which is getting worse, along with anxiety, insomnia and loss of libido. I can never find any advice about HRT for women who don't have ovaries or a uterus. It seems as though I should have had a more balanced HRT therapy all these years, but have only had estrogen. How can I get things back in balance and get my life back to "normal". Thanks.
Feb 08, 2011
 Progesterone
by: Wray

Hi there It is true, women used to be, and some still are, pregnant for much of their reproductive years. If childless we have up to 450 menstruations in a lifetime, but if we have 12 children this drops to about 240. It does help keep us younger, there is evidence it's protective in ageing for instance, see here, here, here and here. But for me the over riding benefit is it's protection against the 100 and more endocrine disruptors which now pollute the planet. These mimic the action of oestrogen, see the website Our Stolen Future. Often women in peri-menopause are diagnosed with slow thyroids and given meds, but often it's no more than a lack of vitamin D. A lack of this vitamin also reduces the benefits of progesterone. For more info see the Vitamin D council website. Take care Wray
Feb 08, 2011
 How much natural progesterone?
by: Wray

Hi Jackie Well I've been using it for 15 years now, and haven't found a fat build up! I can still tell when I've not been using enough, stress drops levels, and I find if I go through a stressful patch I need more. My nails became very weak, flaking and peeling off last year. I'd got so used to using it, it took 3 months before it dawned on me I needed more progesterone. I used 2tsp or 330mg per day for 2 weeks. I went through all the usual oestrogen dominance symptoms, with tiredness and aches in every joint and my muscles. But persevered and 2 weeks later the symptoms went, but I had strong nails again! Besides the fatty layer is essential to it's absorption, see Menopause: March/April 2005 - Volume 12 - Issue 2 - pp 232-237 One study found it didn't build up, admittedly they were using a low amount of 40mg/day, see here It's difficult to tell how long is needed on the high amount, it's best to go by symptoms, reducing slowly once they've been helped. Increasing when you need more, it should always be used as and when needed. Oestrogen causes prolongation of the QT interval, which results in palpitations, arrhythmia and Torsades de Pointes. These occur far more frequently in women. Whereas progesterone shortens the QT interval, see here, here, here, here and here. So hopefully your palpitations will be helped. You could also try the amino acid taurine, the most important nutrient for the heart, about 2000-5000mg/day. Jackie I'm running out of space, so will open a new comment, which will appear below this on the web page. Take care Wray
Feb 08, 2011
 How much natural progesterone?
by: Wray

Hi again Jackie Your daughter will benefit from it, I put mine on it at 14, she's still using it and is now 29. Don't forget a foetus is bathed in it for 9 months so it cannot harm, they also give it to preterm infants with respiratory distress syndrome. It will help the asthma too, see here and here. Blood glucose can be disturbed prior to bleeding, it's the ratio of oestrogen to progesterone becoming skewed, with oestrogen predominating. Acne also indicates a disturbed blood glucose. If insulin increases due to high blood glucose, it stimulates the production of androgens, it's this which causes the acne. One reason teenage boys get it far worse than girls. We do have a page on Acne, please read through it as it gives a full explanation. Your daughter is technically a woman as she's begun her periods, so she can use an adult amount. I suggest you try her with about 100mg/day to begin with, divided into am and pm, and just monitor her symptoms. If you find she still gets the problems you mention, you could increase the amount for the few days prior to bleeding, rather than using a higher amount for the full 14 days. The only known side effect I've come across is euphoria, what a way to go! But the amount has to be very high, in fact it can be used an an anaesthetic too, but pharmacological amounts are needed for this, see here. It's a very long paper, but fascinating if you have the time. Bless you for the kind words too! Take care Wray
Feb 20, 2011
 Hysterectomy
by: Wray

Hi Janet There's no question the oestrogen caused the weight gain. It's a mitogen, stimulating cells to divide and multiply, including fat cells. But these are a non-ovarian source of oestrogen, so a vicious cycle starts. Plus it causes Insulin Resistance and more, see our page on HRT too. If the ovaries are removed, not only does oestrogen drop, bearing in mind it never drops to zero because of fat cells, but progesterone plummets. Doctors are oblivious to the fact that progesterone is not simply a pregnancy hormone, but plays a huge role in many other bodily systems. So whether there's been a hysterectomy or not, surely both hormones should be replaced? There's evidence it's beneficial for ageing too, see here, here, here and here. This paper is excellent on oestrogen, see here. I'm not in favour of any oestrogen, believing we have too much as it is. There are over 100 oestrogen mimics in our environment, see the website Our Stolen Future for more info. Progesterone is the only substance which can counter this excess safely. If you do decide you'd like to try it, please read these pages we have first, Menopause, Oestrogen Dominance and Coming off HRT.
Take care Wray
Feb 20, 2011
 "Early period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, I started my 13 year old daughter on the Natpro about 1 month ago, she has been taking 100 mg/day. She finished her period & then exactly 14days from the start of her period, she is getting bleeding again, is this normal? Or should I reduce the amount of Natpro?? I also experienced bleeding about 9 days following my period, should we just persevere with the 100/mg a day of the Natpro & will this help to bring the period, especially for my daughter into balance?? She has never had an irregular period before starting the Natpro cream. I am seeing that the acne is clearing up in my daughter, so I am just not sure about the early bleeding??Thank you for your advice.
Feb 25, 2011
 I don't feel like I know enough
by: Tyring to Learn

I just started a "compounded" progesterone 40MG/ML cream. Is this a natural supplement? I take 2 clicks in the AM from day 14 of mensus to day 1. So how much am I really taking?

I just feel like I am so out of whack. I am 40 yrs old, have hypothyroidism (diagnosed at age 26). I have 5 children. All of those pregnancies were insulin resistant- one of those gestational diabetes. It just seems like I fell apart after #5 and breasfeeding him. I have recently found out I am severely anemic and severely Vit D deficient. I have been so tired and depressed for years. I thought I was just supposed to kick through it. But when I started getting more angry the more tired I got, my husband suggested I get some help. My hair falls out in handfuls still. I have probably lost half of the hair on my head. I've never even mentioned the cracked heels to my doctor- but they crack and bleed. I've tried to loose weight- I go to the gym regularly and try to eat well- but have had no success until I started the iron supplement 3 months ago. I lost 8 lbs and seem to be stuck there. Need to loose 15 more to be in normal range.

So for my question- does any of this sound crazy? Am I just a whimp? Am I taking enough progesterone? It just makes me wonder if the diagnosis all these years has been right or wrong? Any of my doctors (until now) have all just said I was normal and come back in 3 months.
Feb 28, 2011
 Bleeding and progesterone
by: Anne

I am 53 yrs old, and premenopausal..my periods have pretty much stopped (I get a little spotting every couple of months). Applied a progesterone cream for the 1st time a few weeks ago...within a few days, I got a much heavier period than I have in years...normal/abnormal???
Mar 03, 2011
 "Early period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie Sorry this reply is so late, I'm inundated with queries. It is normal to have either an early period or late one when first using progesterone. It does settle down after a few cycles. There's more info on our page here about late or early cycles and what to do. I'm pleased the acne seems to be clearing, let's hope all her other troubles get sorted out too! Take care Wray
Mar 03, 2011
 I don't feel like I know enough
by: Wray

Hi there None of your symptoms are normal, you should feel well all the time, bar the odd infection or stressful time. So no it doesn't sound crazy. Reading about the hypothyroidism and then the IR and gestational diabetes immediately made me suspect low vitamin D, and then I read it in the next sentence. Then the tiredness and depression merely reinforced this. Do you know what your level is? And are you taking enough to bring it up? The minimum dose should be 5000iu's per day, but if yours is severely low, I would suggest 20000iu's for a couple of months, then 10000iu's for another month or two, then another test. If your level is now in the 70-100ng/ml range you could drop down to the 5000iu's/day. Vitamin D is necessary for the growth phase of hair too. A lack also causes Insulin Resistance, which is probably why you're finding it difficult to loose weight. Please make sure you take enough, for more info see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. Cracked heels are caused by an hormonal imbalance, mine used to crack and bleed before I used progesterone. Now I have no cracks at all. The 40mg/ml of cream is a good strength, but I would need to know how much cream is dispensed with 1 click before I could tell you how much you're getting. I recommend 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms. Progesterone should be used a minimum of twice a day too, please see this page we have on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Mar 03, 2011
 Bleeding and progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Anne Yes it is normal. Your ovaries are producing too little oestrogen to build a lining up every month now. But over time it can build up, normally this is eventually absorbed back into the body. But using progesterone in the early phases of menopause can cause a heavier bleed. It's 'cleaning' the uterus out, which is a good thing. It very rarely occurs again, but as you are not quite in menopause yet, it could occur again. We do have two pages you might like to read on Peri-menopause and Menopause. In case you haven't been warned about it, please read our page on Oestrogen Dominance. Take care Wray
Mar 08, 2011
 Taking Progesterone cream after a complete Hysterectomy
by: Sharon M

Can you safely use Progesteron Cream after a complete Hysterectomy? I know my hormones are completely off.
Mar 09, 2011
 Taking Progesterone cream after a complete Hysterectomy
by: Wray

Hi Sharon Yes you can, in fact removing the ovaries means not only is oestrogen reduced, but progesterone too. But the medical profession for some reason believe we only need to replace oestrogen. As this is a mitogen and an inflammatory hormone, implicated in a number of diseases not least cancer, it's an extraordinary decision. Whereas progesterone does not causes cancer, see our page on Cancer and progesterone. Progesterone is a potent diuretic and analgesic too. But if you should consider it, please use sufficient. I recommend 100-200mg/day. If a low amount is used Oestrogen Dominance can occur, which is unpleasant. Please read this page we have on Menopause for more info on it's use. There are many Delivery systems on the market, please look through this page for info on them. Take care Wray
Mar 17, 2011
 Can I use progesterone cream if I have fibroids?
by: Veronica

Hi WRAY
What a great site, and what a mine of information you are!
Please could you advise me? I am 56 years old, and entered menapause 2 years ago. I haver never been on medication, no Pill etc. and always had v.heavy periods. I have been through the hot sweats, headaches and mood swings with the menapause without any help. I have just been told that I have 2 fibroids the size of cricket balls floating! I was also told to forget about them, and not worry. I have acne rosacea at the moment, and feel like a hundred years old! Would a natural progesterone cream make a difference to me, in your opinion please? I appreciate your advice, thanks, Veronica
Mar 18, 2011
 Can I use progesterone cream if I have fibroids?
by: Wray

Hi Veronica Thanks for the kind words! Having had all those symptoms you describe, and discovering progesterone at their height, I don't know how you coped! Fibroids are an inflammatory disorder, caused by oxidative stress, but stimulated by oestrogen. So anti-inflammatory nutrients are needed, in particular vitamin D, see here, here and here. Plus progesterone to suppress excess oestrogen. MMP's are also implicated, these are proteolytic enzymes, needed by the body, but in excess they have an inflammatory action, see here. Oestrogen stimulates their production, progesterone suppresses them, see here. Although you are in menopause, your fat cells, no matter how few or many you have, make oestrogen. Oestrogen also stimulates fat cells to divide and multiply, so a vicious cycle starts. Normally fibroids are absorbed back into the body once in menopause, as oestrogen levels decline. Which is why you've been told not to worry about them. I'm pleased about this as more often than not a 'knife happy' surgeon is only to happy to remove them! Vitamin D is essential for the skin too, many skin disorders manifest due to a lack of it. Please have a test done, see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. Please see this newsletter here. You'll have to scroll down, or do 'control-find' for the rosacea. More papers here, here, here and here. Progesterone is excellent for the skin, see here, and it's an anti-inflammatory, but I haven't found any papers on it's effect of rosacea. Take care Wray
Mar 23, 2011
 Fibroids
by: Veronica

Dear Wray
Thankyou so much for your reply, I will definitely try everything you have suggested. What a great help to me this site has been, thanks again, Veronica
Mar 25, 2011
 Fibroids
by: Wray

Hi Veronica So pleased the info has helped you! Would love to know how you get on with the rosacea, if it helps I'll be able to tell others. I forgot to give you this link on fibroids, she's quite a card, but the progesterone did help her. Not that I think she used enough, and only used it on her hands, but it did help her which is the main thing, see here. Take care Wray
Mar 25, 2011
 be careful
by: Chris

Get advice from naturopath or kinesiologist before using high does, high does caused me to get night sweats, poor sleep and chornic depression. A few months later I was told that my progesterone was fine and my estrogen had become too low are tests. Even now after balancing my hormones I am suffering horrible depression that I have not had before.

I wish I had checked what I was doing was right first.
Mar 27, 2011
 heart palpitations
by: Sue

Hello,
Before I ask my question, I must commend your kindness and patience in your answers. I have read through the website looking for the answer to my question and greatly admire your respect for others, even when their opinions seem combative. Until a year ago, I used progesterone cream for three years. Began the use of it primarily, for irregular and increasingly heavy periods. A year ago I began experiencing heart palpitations the week or so before my period. Very strong, very concerning. My heart checked out fine. As a shot in the dark remedy, I quit the cream and they abated. About 6 months ago I miscarried, went back on the cream for a short while, while on it, the palps came back strong. I am off the cream now and I have only a few , in no particular pattern. I am presently 47, with regular 28 day cycles but heavy periods. I am considering beginning the cream again for other peri-menopause symptoms but am concerned about the palps increasing again. I understand from the reading I have done here, about your belief that the dose needs to be high enough to oppose the estrogen. So I assume that would be your response. So in return my question is: If my dose needs to be higher, Why did the palps stop when I quit the cream? I am confused. I have read research that is contradictory as to whether palpitations are caused/remedied by the use of progesterone! I would appreciate your input very much. Thank you.
Mar 28, 2011
 be careful
by: Wray

Hi Chris I would have to know how high the amount was that caused you to get those symptoms. I suspect in fact that it wasn't high enough, as all those symptoms fall under Oestrogen Dominance. Progesterone is excellent for sleep, see here. It's also a potent anxiolytic too, please see our page on Anxiety. Listed on this page are other nutrients which help depression and anxiety. And it does help night sweats too. You might like to see this paper on the effects of oral progesterone for hot flushes, see here. Unfortunately it doesn't work as well as a cream, a 300mg/day dose reduced the flushes by 56% and it took 12 weeks to do so. On the other hand, I find about 400mg progesterone per day in cream form, used for about 4-5 days, stops them or reduces them dramatically. For more info on how to use a progesterone cream please see our page on Peri-menopause and Menopause. Take care Wray
Mar 29, 2011
 heart palpitations
by: Wray

Hi Sue Thanks so much for the kind words, there have been a few combative comments! The reason the palps stop and start when using progesterone appears a paradox. It's because progesterone stimulates oestrogen when first using it, the converse is also true. It occurs too when increasing the amount from low to high or if the ratio of the two hormones becomes skewed. This last is the reason for Oestrogen Dominance. Also see here and here. You are now in Peri-menopause (P-M), during which progesterone levels drop. In fact they've been dropping since about age 35. But oestrogen remains at it's normal level until menopause, when the ovaries cease making it. Although our fat cells continue making it till we die! So each time you use progesterone you're stimulating oestrogen. Two things can cause the palps. One is a de-stabilised blood glucose, oestrogen can do this, progesterone helps stabilise it. If blood glucose drops too low, too fast, hot flushes, a racing heart/palps, cold clammy skin, nausea, headaches and more can occur. This often occurs the few days prior to our period when it's caused by a skewed progesterone to oestrogen ratio. Both hormones drop then, but if oestrogen drops slowly, and progesterone too fast, or if it was low in the first instance, all manner of symptoms occur. After a miscarriage or birth, progesterone drops sharply. Using the cream then would have caused adverse symptoms, unless a high enough amount had been used to overcome the oestrogen. The other reason is that oestrogen causes prolongation of the QT interval, which results in palpitations, arrhythmia and Torsades de Pointes. Whereas progesterone shortens the QT interval, see here, here, here, here and here. Men rarely suffer from this as they make little oestrogen. Please look through these two possibilities to see which you think it is. In either case it's excess oestrogen causing it. As you have P-M symptoms, plus heavy bleeding, it's an indication yours is too high. I'm running out of space, so will open a new comment. Take care Wray
Mar 29, 2011
 heart palpitations
by: Wray

Hi again Sue Oestrogen is a mitogen, it stimulates cells to grow. Vital in stimulating the endometrium each month to grow and thicken ready for a possible fertilised egg. But in excess it stimulates cells to continue growing. MMP?s are enzymes that break down protein. They play a role in the breakdown of endometrial tissues at the end of the menstrual cycle. If they are over active, as would be the case with excess oestrogen in the body (oestrogen stimulates their production), the result is a pathological reaction. A high level of MMP's can lead to inflammation and excessive bleeding in the uterus. If a low level of progesterone is present, and a high level of oestrogen, the lining will continue to grow. With a high level of MMP's the lining will also continue to break down. Progesterone suppresses both MMP's and oestrogen. See here and here. It's essential to use a high amount of progesterone if the bleeding is continual, between 400-600mg/day. If there is a cycle, it?s best to ignore it and use the progesterone daily, hourly too, until the bleeding is under control. If the bleeding is not continual, but a very heavy normal period, then 200-300mg/day should be sufficient. The progesterone can be used to regulate the cycle once bleeding has stopped. Although once in P-M this is not possible, cycles come and go at will and there's nothing we can do to prevent this. Palpitations can be frightening, I know they will occur again if you try the progesterone. What I can't tell you is how severe they will be or how long it will take for them to pass. Or whether to try the very high amount, or take it very slowly and use a tiny bit each day, gradually increasing the amount as you see fit. I wish I could! Please have a vitamin D test done, this is low in most of us, and has a huge bearing on the heart. For more info see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. Please consider taking 5000iu's per day, this is the minimum recommended by the boffins. And please consider taking about 2000-5000mg/day of the amino acid taurine, a lack of taurine also causes palpitations etc., see here. You had a miscarriage, this is often caused by a drop in progesterone, for more info please see our page on Pregnancy. Take care Wray
Mar 29, 2011
 thank you
by: Sue

Wray,
Thank you so much for the time you took to answer my questions. Also for the studies you cited, I am grateful for the opportunity to dig deeper.
Sue
Mar 29, 2011
 side effects
by: Chris

Hi Wray

I have seen lots of people who told me as a male it was too high a dose 200mg a day for three weeks and that my estrogen levels were affected. If I had high estrogen I would develop gyno?

saliva and vega machine testing showed that my progesterone was normal and my estrogen was very low.

I was given homeopathic estrogen which I think helped a little, but I have been unbelieveable depressed since using progesterone cream, more depressed then ever in my life.

I saw a kinesiologist who has told me that my hormones are normal but I am suffering from post varal and some emotional issues.

Although I had some bad things happen to me in my life I was able to mentally cope, but now I have fallen apart.
Mar 29, 2011
 progesterone side effects
by: Anonymous

I'm so glad I foung this website it explains so much as to why what has been happening to me since I started this. 51, still having periods doc suggested progesterone to combat some of my symptoms, night sweats etc. But feel worse on the progesterone jittery and nervous, hot flash, 2xs a day 20 each dose day 12 through 26. Very comfused what should I do? really do not want to take it. HELP!
Mar 30, 2011
 thank you
by: Wray

Hi Sue Glad they were of help. Do hope you come right soon. Take care Wray
Mar 30, 2011
 place of application
by: Sue

I don't know how to correctly link an article. If doing this : http://www.mercola.com/article/progesterone/cream.aspx Breaks the site rules, I am sorry. I was wondering if you could comment on the information in it. That progesterone builds up in the fat and that women may need a break from it? The article also mentions a different place to apply the cream, could you comment on the efficacy of that also? Thanks.
Mar 30, 2011
 Applying P cream in the vagina
by: Jessica

Hi Wray, I just started using the cream I ordered from you and came across an interesting article while researching the best way to apply it. The article is from Dr. Mercola, who you're likely familiar with, and I really trust his opinions. The article regarding P cream can be viewed at: http://www.mercola.com/article/progesterone/cream.htm
My question regards how best to apply P cream to the vagina. According to that article, applying the cream to the vagina is far more beneficial and likely to produce positive effects over the long term, without causing the many negative effects reported by women who have been applying the cream to their skin over the long term. So I guess I have two questions:

*Do you agree with this article?
*How in the heck can I apply this cream to my vagina?!

I keep trying and, well...it just ends up falling out, or becoming really messy and drippy when applied to the labia. I don't get how to put such a large amount of this stuff (I'm doing 100 mg) in and on there and keep it there!

Thanks,
Jessica
Mar 31, 2011
 side effects
by: Wray

Hi Chris I'm a bit puzzled by your query. Are you using 200mg/day progesterone? And if you are how long have you been using this amount? I recommend 10-100mg/day for men, dependant on symptoms. Although I don't believe 200mg/day will harm you at all. The depression has occurred because initially progesterone stimulates oestrogen, making it the dominant hormone. This leads to Oestrogen Dominance. It's essential to make progesterone the dominant hormone, only when this occurs will the depression lift. It can take time, dependant on how much oestrogen is present. I don't understand why you are using it for 3 weeks, and then presumably taking a break? Men make progesterone daily, they have no cycle as a woman does, so there's no need for the break. Besides which, during the break progesterone levels will drop, which in turn will make oestrogen rise adding to the depression. We do have a page on Anxiety, it explains the reasons behind depression and anxiety. There is also a list of nutrients which help lift them, you might consider taking them. High progesterone levels will not induce gyno, the reverse in fact, as progesterone suppresses oestrogen which causes it. You don't mention your testosterone levels, it could be these are too low. Testosterone raises dopamine and serotonin, which both stop depression occurring, see here, here, here and here. It could be your dopamine has dropped too, excess oestrogen causes this, and raises prolactin, which also depresses dopamine production. Not knowing the full story, it's difficult for me to advise further. Take care Wray
Mar 31, 2011
 progesterone side effects
by: Wray

Hi there The amount of progesterone you've been advised to use is far too low. I recommend 100-200mg/day dependant on symptoms. When first using it, progesterone stimulates oestrogen production, see Oestrogen Dominance. This is causing the adverse symptoms you are experiencing, please consider increasing the amount. You are now in Peri-menopause, a most difficult time. Please read through this page, as it will give advice on how much and when to use progesterone. I don't know why you've been advised to use it from day 12 to 26. It should only be used during the luteal phase, which is always 12-14 days after ovulation or before bleeding, in all women. For more info on this please see our page on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Mar 31, 2011
 progesterone side effects
by: Wray

Hi there The amount of progesterone you've been advised to use is far too low. I recommend 100-200mg/day dependant on symptoms. When first using it, progesterone stimulates oestrogen production, see Oestrogen Dominance. This is causing the adverse symptoms you are experiencing, please consider increasing the amount. You are now in Peri-menopause, a most difficult time. Please read through this page, as it will give advice on how much and when to use progesterone. I don't know why you've been advised to use it from day 12 to 26. It should only be used during the luteal phase, which is always 12-14 days after ovulation or before bleeding, in all women. For more info on this please see our page on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Apr 01, 2011
 SIDE EFFECTS
by: jane

HI WRAY, LET ME GET THIS STRAIGHT, 100 TO 200 MG TRANSDERMALLY ON DAYS 12 TO 14 AFTER OVALATION. WOULD THAT NOT BE DAY 12 TO DAY 26 OF MY CYCLE? AND EACH TIME I STOP THE PROGESTERONE AND THEN START AGAIN THE FOLLOWING MONTH WILL I EXPERIENCE THE SAME ESTROGEN DOMINATE SYMPTOMS AGAIN? SO FAR THIS HAS HAPPENEND TO ME FOR THE LAST 2 MONTHS. I THOUGHT TAKING PROGESTERONE TRANSDERMALLY YOUR DOSAGE SHOULD BE LESS THAN ORALLY BECAUCE IT BYPASSES THE LIVER? THANKS
Apr 02, 2011
 exactly how much?
by: Anonymous

to get 100 mg from natpro how many teaspoons a day must one use? thanks jane
Apr 10, 2011
 need answers
by: Dee

I'm 53 yrs old and having problems such as bloating etc. Since I started this natural progesteron cream it seemed to get alot worse I started 4 days ago and have gained five pounds. Im I not taking enough progesterone? I take 40 mg 1/2 in morning other half at night my progesterone level was 0.5 and estrone was 41. How much time does it take to work? Is there anything else I can do? Please Help
Apr 12, 2011
 Withdrawal
by: jenn

I am currently perscribed one pump a day for 14 days of a topical progesterone cream. I feel fine while using the cream but have horrible let down when I go off of it. I get horrible headaches, I feel anxious and sad. I also am very irritable and it makes it harder to deal with daily irritants of motherhood ect... I feel like I am having withdrawal from a substance when I go off of this stuff. I am also having the worst pimples I have ever had and I definitely am experiencing weight gain, which I though would be helped by using the progesterone lotion. Is it normal to feel so awful when you stop the lotion for the 14 days after using it? I dread it each month and it seems to be getting worse not better. Thank you Jenn
Apr 13, 2011
 exactly how much?
by: Wray

Hi Jane 3ml of the cream, or just over 1/2 teaspoon, would give you 100mg progesterone. 1/2 tsp is 2.5ml. We do give measurements at the very bottom of this page on How to use progesterone cream Take care Wray
Apr 13, 2011
 SIDE EFFECTS
by: Wray

Hi Jane If you have a 26 day cycle, then yes you should start using the cream on day 12, for the next 14 days. But if for instance your cycle is only 21 days long, you should start the cream on day 7, which is when you would ovulate. A woman with a 35 day cycle would start the cream on day 21 which is when she would ovulate. Our cycles range from 21 to 35 days, making 28 days the average. All women, irrespective of the length of their cycle ovulate 12-14 days before bleeding. Progesterone should be used from ovulation, which is when the ovaries start making it. Unless symptoms are severe, when I suggest using it daily for 2-3 months to reduce or eliminate them, and suppress the excess oestrogen. If sufficient progesterone is used, Oestrogen Dominance should not occur each time you stop and start the progesterone. Evidently your oestrogen is still too high, it might be an idea to use the progesterone daily as I suggested above. And then when you feel stable, to start following your cycle again. Alternatively you could increase the amount you use for the few days prior to bleeding, if this is when your symptoms are most severe. For more info please see our page on How to use progesterone cream. You are correct, using progesterone transdermally it does bypass the liver. But the amount needed does not depend on this, but on symptoms. The more severe they are the more is needed. It's easy to reduce the amount once symptoms have gone. Take care Wray
Apr 23, 2011
 Days 21-28
by: Michelle

I am taking a 100 mg troche of progesterone during days 21-28 of my cycle as recommended by my dr. I haven't seen any other posts mentioning days 21-28 and was curious if this dozing pattern is effective or not? I am 37 and my saliva hormone test showed that after my progesterone peaks, it drops off quicker than it should. I have only taken the progesterone for one cycle so far and I am absolutely miserable. I am lethargic all day, have tender, sore breasts, have intense headaches, severe water retention and weight gain, and my period was a small spotting, but with intense cramping. I am wondering if this is all worth it! I did the test because of my PCOS, to check hormone levels, not because I felt poorly. All levels were fine except the drop off of progesterone level too rapidly. Thanks for thoughts/opinions.
Apr 27, 2011
 Progesterone
by: Anonymous

My T4 is 1.1, I had been using for the last two years Troche that included Thyroid medication, DHEA, Estrogen., Testo;Progesterone and had no sleep problems.

Last Friday I started in PM with 200mg capsule progesterone only and testosterone in cream, it took over an hour to fall asleep, next day one hour and a half the following day tw hours, then the fourth day sleep for 2 hours the whole night and that was it no sleep at all!!!

the new troche medication includes Estogene,50mg progesterone ONLY. I now take separate DHEA (SR) 5M capsule; testoterone in cream and Thyroid 15mg seperate capsule instead of added in the troche.

Do you think this maybe a sudden blast I received the first day of progesterone 200 mg capsule with testoterone cause this was the only thing I took the first day I started in PM with my sleep problems?

last night I did not take my progesterone and had the same sleep problem unable to fall asleep. Desperately I finished up taking 2.5mg
of ativan.

What could my sleep problem be supprees cortisol from the progesterone or what?
Apr 30, 2011
 Is there any progesterone or estergen without soy in it?
by: Anonymous

My sister is allergic to soy. All the creams and natural pills have soy in them that has been given to her. Is there any without soy in it?
May 01, 2011
 PCOS and progesterone cream
by: Andrea

I have PCOS and read that natural progesterone cream can be helpful in treating this disease. I started the cream a few weeks ago to bring on my period becuase it is very irregular and I have missed it for a few months. I used the cream as directed for 14 days and now I am on my break which is supposed to bring on my period. Since I started the cream my breasts have been really sore and I have been really tired and irritable....like bad PMS. What is causing this? Will it get better? I have read great things about natural progesterone cream and would really like to continue using, but need to understand what is going wrong.

Thanks!
May 04, 2011
 Days 21-28
by: Wray

Hi Michelle Troche's are not the best Delivery system. I find too little is absorbed by the mouth, the rest getting swallowed. Once this occurs it's broken down by the gut and liver, so very little gets to where it's needed. A low amount of progesterone keeps stimulating more oestrogen, leading to the symptoms you've described. There's more info about this on our Oestrogen Dominance page. I've found between 100-200mg/day seems to be the best range. Certainly to start with, as it's entirely dependant on symptoms. Although you had none, PCOS generally has higher than normal oestrogen, high testosterone and low progesterone. And yet you say your levels were normal. Possibly your oestrogen was high 'normal' and your progesterone low 'normal'. But did they check the ratio of the two? This is far more critical than the amount present. Progesterone should always be used from ovulation, not from day 21, which in a 28 day cycle is in the middle of the luteal phase. Is your cycle 28 days, they can range from 21 to 35, making 28 the average. Progesterone dropping off too rapidly means you have a defective luteal phase. If you want to fall pregnant, then it can pose a problem. But quite frankly, if you're not concerned about that, and you have no symptoms at all, I see little point in using progesterone. Having said that it is very beneficial! If you read the PCOS page, you'll notice that oxidative stress is behind it. Very often from a vitamin D deficiency, please have a test done. For more info see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. Take care Wray
May 04, 2011
 HELP!!
by: Anonymous

I was on a protocol that used very high estradiol cream, increasing daily going with the lunar calendar and then adding in the progesterone cream on day 14 until you bleed. Their philosophy was to bring a woman back to her 20's and make her feel like she did when she was young. I was miserable on it. I had so much anxiety, depression, shakes, insomnia and every symptom you can imagine. I had to resort to taking valium just to get through the days and nights but not everyday to avoid addiction. I was convinced it was making me sick and stopped them all in 7 weeks. Then I saw another gyno who specializes in BRHT and gave me much less estrogen (estradiol) and progesterone (via oral) with 10mg of pregnenolone. I took one pill last night of the progesterone and rubbed the cream into my wrist area last night and this AM. I can tell you how badly I felt again. The anxiety increased, I began to shake, my stomach went into a knot again, my head felt like it was going to explode and my palpitations got worse. I did a saliva test yesterday and am convinced that my cortisol levels are either high or low, DHEA, estrogen, progesterone are all messed up but for some reason I feel sick on these bioidentical hormones. I have enough of other health issues I deal with and being sick on these hormones are exacerbating how terrible I feel daily. I don't want to wake up to another horrible day, I have no life and all I want to do is cry, but can't due to emotional blunting. Maybe I am emotionally sick. I have been to therapist and shrinks and 3 AD's either didn't work or made me sicker. I have high blood pressure and now terrible palpitations and the Antidepressants only made these things much worse. I couldn't function on the lexapro I took for 10 days. I was so weak on it. Gabapentin also failed me. My estrogen went from 62 to 34 in the 7 weeks I was on the Wiley protocol of bioidenticals and now I just want to quit again. I can't keep going up and down like this but I am convinced that these hormones are not agreeing with me, is this possible? Maybe its just GAD (generalized anxiety disorder) and not hormonal. But meds didn't work either. I don't know what to do anymore, I am scared and nervous and no one can seem to help me. Don't know what to do anymore. Please help me. I have tried all the natural supplements to relieve the anxiety too, but they too failed me. Nothing works for me, why??? Thanks so much for listening.
May 06, 2011
 Progesterone
by: Wray

Hi there Troches are not the best Delivery system for progesterone, little gets absorbed by the mouth, the rest being swallowed. Once in the gut most of it gets destroyed, the liver metabolising the rest. So the amount of progesterone you were getting was minimal. Oestrogen on the other hand is not destroyed by the gut. Oral progesterone is the least effective delivery system, but the 200mg/day would certainly have made a difference to your overall level. But not sufficiently to prevent the Oestrogen Dominance you are now suffering from. Initially progesterone stimulates oestrogen, so your oestrogen has risen, hence the adverse symptoms. Testosterone should never be given to women, see here, here, here, here, here here, here, here, here, here and here. Nor should DHEA as it increases oestrogen and testosterone, plus it can cause cysts and cancer, see here, here, here and here. I recommend 100-200mg/day progesterone, but in a form which is absorbed well, either injections, suppositories or creams. Please consider changing to any one of these, for more info see our page on How to use progesterone. Take care Wray
May 10, 2011
 Possible cancer risk?
by: Anonymous

Hormones are very complicated. I don't think anyone really understands the way they affect the human body. Also different people are affected in different ways. Just look at the birth control pill, for some it is heaven sent, and for others they suffer lots of side effects. I was going through menopause and feeling lousy, and I read a book about progesterone and how it could cure almost everything. I first had my hormone levels tested. They were close to zero, or at a level undetectable in my blood. Maybe this is normal for a woman going through menopause. The follicle stimulating hormone was high though. I started using natural progesterone - the type you rub in your skin. I can't say anything improved and my breast swelled and felt weird. The worst thing was that I was diagnosed with ovarian cancer a few months later. Maybe I already had this cancer, but I wonder if the progesterone caused it to grow? Ovarian cancer is very commonly estrogen positive (estrogen makes it grow), and it also can be progesterone positive. I did not have my tumor tested so do not know if it was positive, but this is a hormone driven cancer.
Now I know a lot of people have their pet theories that progesterone reduces the risk of cancer, but I really don't think they know. Now I am in remission and I will never take any hormones again. In fact I try as much as possible to reduce estrogenic or other hormone producing foods and herbs in my diet. My message is be careful.
May 13, 2011
 Possible cancer risk?
by: Wray

Hi there I do agree with you, no one knows fully the enormously complicated way in which hormones work. The reason your breasts swelled was Oestrogen Dominance, evidently you were using a very low amount of progesterone. Probably the recommended 20-40mg/day. I recommend 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms. Anything lower generally causes bad oestrogen dominance. Oestrogen is a mitogen, causing cells to divide and multiply, progesterone stops this mitotic activity. We do have a page on Cancer and progesterone. You'll see there are many studies where it's been used successfully. Take care Wray
May 15, 2011
 Progesterone helped HUGELY now BAD
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray, thankyou for taking the time to listen and reply to all of us gals! I have been using natural biodentical progesterone for quite some time with fantastic results! but this month was a horror story!

I began applying it at a teaspoon twice per day as I always do, two weeks before my period, then BAM oh my goodness, all hell broke loose. Nausea, SEVERE gas, and stomach pains, huge swollen breasts, heaps of clear discharge. My period was late, so I assumed I was pregnant. The symptoms I have mimic preganancy to a T. My period arrived a week late, with immense cramping, something I do not normally have.

I am so distressed. I am 39, does perimenopause sometimes bring on symptoms like I described, or do you think I have just overloaded myself with too much progesterone cream and should have a break?
Thanks in advance, Christy.
May 17, 2011
 PROGESTERONE INTO TESTERONE
by: Netty

Hi Wray, is it true that if you take to much progesterone it can build up & convert into testosterone, in your body?? This info. was gathered from a hormone lab in Canada (online info.) Also can the symptoms of estrogen dominance change from month to month while starting the progesterone cream, I have been taking it for 4 months now, and it seems each month the symptoms are changing. Is it safe to take large amounts of progesterone for a long duration of time? I know you have been on progesterone for a long time & wanted to know how long it took you to be able to decrease your amounts? Thank you for all the support you give women.
May 19, 2011
 "No period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, I have been taking the Natpro cream for 4 months now, (between 150 - 200 mg) a day. I had very heavy periods the first 2 months, and then the 3rd month had no period at all, now this month I feel as though my period wants to come, but is being delayed. I am not sure what is happening. I have had regular periods up to starting the Natpro cream. Is it true that estrogen dominance can cause irregular menstral cycles?? I am not sure if I should reduce the amount of cream or increase it, to get my period to start?

Thanks so much for you help & relpy.
May 23, 2011
 Progesterone helped HUGELY now BAD
by: Wray

Hi Christy Thanks for the kind words! It's so interesting you've made the connection between the early stages of pregnancy and Oestrogen Dominance, no one seems to. But there is no difference. In early pregnancy progesterone rises, this then stimulates oestrogen and as you say, all hell breaks loose! Then when progesterone finally becomes the dominant hormone, symptoms calm down and eventually go, leaving the woman feeling wonderful. Except for the 10% who have a tough time, mainly nausea. This also responds to supplemental progesterone, but the amount needs to be in excess of 330mg/day. If you were having such good results, and then a horror time, plus your period was late, it is possible you were in fact pregnant. Alternatively you could have had more stress this past cycle, but you were not aware of it, this has happened to me. Stress causes progesterone levels to drop. Or you didn't ovulate that cycle, so your progesterone was lower than normal. All three could account for the adverse symptoms. It's impossible to tell of course. Anovulatory cycles start occurring round about age 35, often a time when PMS symptoms are worst. A lack of ovulation means no progesterone is made, so oestrogen is the dominant hormone. These cycles occur more and more frequently until menopause, when the ovaries stop producing viable eggs. Which means oestrogen is rising, with no progesterone to counter it. Peri-menopause normally starts 5 to 10 years before Menopause. This occurs on average at age 51, unless your mother went into menopause slightly early, I feel you are on the young side to be in P-M. Are you aware of when you ovulate? If so, next cycle check to see if you have, ie taking temps, a mucus plug coming away, or using a mini-microscope. Then when you start using the cream again, you can tell if the symptoms are due to a lack of ovulation. I don't believe you've overloaded yourself. It was working wonderfully, then suddenly it wasn't. This to me is more like a rise in oestrogen, or a drop in progesterone, it's too sudden to be anything else. But by all means try taking a break, but if you begin feeling in need of progesterone, don't hesitate to start using it again. Take care Wray
May 23, 2011
 PROGESTERONE INTO TESTERONE
by: Wray

Hi Netty Thanks too for the kind words. I wish the people giving the info would do a bit of reading, see here and here. I've never experienced a build up, or saturation of the fatty tissue, or non responsive receptor sites. I have often given myself 330mg/day when stressed more than usual, often for days at a time. And in each case I've experienced Oestrogen Dominance. Which only goes to show my receptors are still working well. It's so easy to experiment too, all one has to do is use more, if no oestrogen dominance occurs, then possibly the person has enough progesterone to prevent this. Oestrogen dominance can occur at any time, many things drop progesterone levels which can lead to it. But it's particularly obvious when first using it, as the body is adjusting to higher levels of progesterone. Dark winter days drop progesterone levels, so do large meals, stress causes a sharp drop, a lack of vitamin D reduces it's benefits, and of course during winter vitamin D levels drop. I use about 170mg/day progesterone, and as I said above I often increase it, sometimes covering myself on occasion. It really depends on the problem, the more severe the symptom the more is needed. It is not dependant on 'dose'. I wish it was, it would make my life much easier! As for a build up of progesterone causing it to be converted into testosterone, I've never heard such nonsense. Luteinising hormone (LH) is secreted by the anterior pituitary gland and is required for both the growth of preovulatory follicles and ovulation of the dominant follicle. Progesterone is the hormone from which first testosterone and then oestrogen are converted. But LH is needed to stimulate this conversion, causing proliferation, differentiation, and secretion of androgens by the theca cells which surround the ovum, hence the rise in androgen levels. With excess androgens, oestrogen also increases. The androgens, notably androstendione, migrate from the theca cells to the granulosa cells where they are converted by the enzyme aromatase into oestrogen, particularly oestradiol. The theca cells also produce oestradiol without the need for conversion. I'm running out of space, so will start a new comment below. Take care Wray
May 23, 2011
 PROGESTERONE INTO TESTERONE
by: Wray

Hi Netty Follicle stimulating hormone (FSH) also plays a role. This increases as the pituitary stimulates new follicles to mature. This increases oestrogen levels too. But high oestrogen also increases thecal cell proliferation, and so a vicious cycle starts. Excessive LH, FSH, the androgens and oestrogens all suppress ovulation. Unless this occurs progesterone is not produced. All this of course plays havoc with the ovaries, and emotions too. So unless your LH is high, or there's a lack of aromatase, I don't think you have to worry about excess testosterone. Besides if there is any excess, supplemental progesterone will suppress it. Unfortunately when I first started progesterone I had no one to ask advice of. I used the 'normal' recommended amount of 20-40mg/day, so it took a full 6 months before my symptoms went. I knew nothing then of oestrogen dominance either, so my early weeks on progesterone are a bit of a blur! I'm now using far more than I did then, so you will just have to play around with the amount. Symptoms are always the best guide on whether to increase or decrease the amount. It's never static though, changing all the time. Take care Wray
May 25, 2011
 "No period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie You say you are using the progesterone each day, does that mean you are not taking a break? If this is so it would explain the lack of period. Please come back to me on this. You also say you feel as if your period wants to come, but is being delayed. This would also be explained by not taking a break. I suggest you stop using the cream now, this should cause you to bleed. If you do have a cycle, you should be using the progesterone from ovulation to bleeding. Progesterone can upset the cycle when first using it, but it does settle down. The heavy periods are merely the progesterone 'cleaning' out the uterus, and is nothing to be alarmed about. Many things can cause irregular cycles, excess oestrogen, testosterone, LH and FSH. Stress plays a big role too. I'm not sure how old you are, but Peri-menopause also causes the cycle to become irregular. Take care Wray
May 25, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, thank you for your reply about my not having a period. I am using the cream everyday, but only between 100-200 mg, I have read in your other blogs that you should only stop having regular periods after using 300-400mg. I am 37 years old, and when I tried to stop the cream for one day, thinking this would bring on my period, I felt shortness of breath, which I know is a symptom of estrogen dominance. I guess I am a little confused as to what to do. I have ALWAYS had a regular period, until starting the Natpro, which makes me think that my body is trying to line up hormonally. I also have felt more symptoms of lower back pain, sore tender breasts,since increasing the cream to 250mg, thinking this would bring on my period. I really don't know what to do, hoping to hear from you soon?? Thanks again for your advice.
May 25, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, also in regards to my no period, how many days after stopping the cream, will my periiod take to get? I would like to get into a regular routine with the cream as well, meaning in my leutal phase. I will try to stop the cream, unless I hear other wise from the previous blog I sent. (this is a continuation from my last blog) Thanks again.
May 25, 2011
 Ovulation after Using Progesterone Cream? Confused.
by: Anna

Hello Wray,
I have fibrocyctic breasts and very irregular periods. In January of this year I went to ER because my heart was fast, 120 bpm for 24hours after a palpitation. Since then, my heart has been given an all clear. I had sub-clinical hyperthyroidism which was returned to normal in March. I still experience my heart rate rising at rest, mostly to 100 but sometimes as high as 120 bpm. For the first 3 months of this year, I was waking from constant nightmares and a subsequent pounding heart. I would also experience hot flushes.

Since the weather has cooled (i'm in the southern hemisphere!) my symptoms have improved a lot. I still wake in the morning with a fast heart (80 bpm)

My periods have been erratic since teenagehood. I had acne and painful periods at age 15. I was placed on the pill and my breasts grew a whole cup size in 2 days. I have stretch marks to prove it! Then all seemed ok until I turned 20 and decided to go off the pill. I felt better, but was uncomfortable with intercourse because I was dry. I swelled a lot with fluid and my acne returned. My periods were almost non-existant and this is when I noticed the fibrocystic lumps.

Over the years I have been very irregular, sometimes only a few times a year.

I am now 31 and for the past 6 months I have been seeing naturopath. In this time my periods have been regularly every 6 weeks. This month it still hasn't come and I am at 6 and a half weeks. Test results have shown my progesterone going up slightly and my testosterone dropping. But my oestrodial E2 has stayed the same, 22 (ref: <10) via saliva test. Serum test showsFSH 8.9 (ref:2.5-10) Oestrodial 116 pmol/L (ref: 70-530) and Progesterone 0.7 nmol/L (ref:<5). These reference ranes are for Follicular Phase. I had the test taken on Day 4 of my cycle (I was mensturating)

I picked up some progesterone cream from my naturopath. It is 10%. I used it yesterday and this morning I woke with a lot of fertile fluid. Have I gone into ovulation? Why would Progesterone bring on ovulation or is there a chance I was going into ovulation before I used the cream?

Also, how much should I be using?

Thanks Wray for any help.
May 29, 2011
 "NO PERIOD"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, this is Jackie again, the "no Period" woman. I took your advice on stoppinbg the cream, and had one of the worst night's ever, I had chills, hot flushes, insomnia, heart palpitations,sweats, etc.. I am 37 yrs old & my question is... Is it possible to take between 100-200(Natpro) everyday & still get a regular cycle?? As I got very erratic cycles the first 2 months being on the cream, (meaning heavy & spotting & heavy,etc.) and then month 3 nothing, now month 4 I have had spotting, thinking it was my period coming & now nothing again. I was taking around 200mg of natpro.I am wondering if I stay taking the cream if I will get another cycle next month & then hopefully will be able to start rotating the cream with my cycle. Could you please let me know if you have heard anything like this & what to do, I really need some advice?? I am also wondering if me taking the Natpro at 200 put my body into the mode of "thinking" it is pregnant?? I just know that when trying to stop, I felt aawefull :( PLease Help?
Jun 03, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie I'll answer all your queries in one as I see there are now three. The 400mg/day is needed to stop severe, heavy, continual bleeding as it suppresses the MMP's. You don't mention having this, so in all probability the 200mg/day is enough to stop yours. Increasing the progesterone to 250mg/day would cause oestrogen dominance symptoms, as you found. But it would not bring on a period, it's only when progesterone drops that this occur. MMP's are enzymes that break down protein. They play a role in the breakdown of endometrial tissues at the end of the menstrual cycle. Oestrogen stimulates MMP's. Progesterone suppresses both MMP's and oestrogen. It's only when progesterone levels drop at the end of the cycle that the MMP?s can get to work and break down the lining causing our monthly bleed. This is why I asked you to stop using the cream, it should normally start within a day or two. The severe symptoms you got when stopping the progesterone shows your oestrogen level is still very high. Oestrogen drops the temperature, progesterone raises it, hence the chills. The hot flushes and insomnia too, progesterone does help sleep, see here, hot flushes too. Oestrogen causes prolongation of the QT interval, which results in palpitations, arrhythmia and Torsades de Pointes. Whereas progesterone shortens the QT interval, see here, here, here, here and here. Hence the palpitations. Giving your age helps, as round about age 35 we begin having anovulatory cycles, when no progesterone is made. As a result oestrogen rises. Anovulatory cycles increase during Peri-menopause, until Menopause, when the ovaries stop producing viable eggs. I've run out of space, so will start a new comment below. Take care Wray
Jun 03, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie Progesterone does take time to settle down, the cycle being very erratic initially. I know of women younger than you who've used it continuously for 6 months before feeling well. So I suggest you continue to use it daily until you feel confident enough to start following your cycle again. You'll know immediately if you're not ready, as you'll get the oestrogen dominance symptoms again. 200mg/day progesterone could make your body believe it's pregnant, as a high level of progesterone stops production of LH and FSH, which is exactly what happens in pregnancy. During the 3rd trimester the range of progesterone varies between 48.4 - 425 ng/ml. Please consider having a vitamin D test done, most of us have too low a level. This impacts on progesterone, as a lack of vitamin D reduces the benefits of progesterone. For more info see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. If you live in the UK I believe Birmingham Hospital is now doing cheap tests. Take care Wray
Jun 03, 2011
 Ovulation after Using Progesterone Cream? Confused.
by: Wray

Hi Anna It sounds as if you have PCOS, has anyone checked for this? Unfortunately taking a test during the follicular phase tells us nothing. It should always be done ±7 days after ovulation, which is ±7 days before bleeding. This is when progesterone and oestrogen peak, during the mid-luteal phase. On day 4 both would be low, although oestrogen does start rising round about day 4 or 5. Progesterone doesn't start rising until ovulation. Although interestingly it has been discovered that there is a progesterone surge prior to the LH surge. They believe it's this surge which causes the LH surge, see here. So yes, progesterone could have initiated ovulation. Alternatively you were about to ovulate anyway. Although at 6 and a half weeks after your last period it seems unlikely. The must do a test at mid-luteal phase to see if you are ovulating. This will be difficult to judge if your cycles are so erratic. But you do say they now come every 6 weeks, bar the last one. This would mean you would ovulate on day 35, which is highly unlikely. Normal cycles range from 21 days to 35 days, making 28 the average. Taking the ratio of progesterone to oestrogen, yours is 6:1, we have found from Saliva Tests we run that to feel well the ratio should be 600:1 and over. Something is upsetting your cycle, it appears you have excess oestrogen which would cause this. High LH would cause it too, but you don't give a test result for this. Did they not do one? If LH and FSH are similar it would indicate PCOS, or if LH is higher than FSH. Please check on this. You say you're in the southern hemisphere, possibly Australia? If so you are probably short of vitamin D. Unfortunately the government's policy of covering up when in the sun, has caused most Australians to have a low level. Vitamin D is critical to ovulation and a normal cycle. Please have a test done. For more info see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. Take care Wray
Jun 12, 2011
 Natural Progesterone Side Effects
by: Tammy

Hello Wray, I hope you can help me. I have been using natural progesterone for almost 3 weeks now. I have noticed a pronounced fishy odor, similar to a yeast infection. Could this be caused by the progesterone? It's very embarrassing and I don't get yeast infections normally, so I'm confused about how to treat it. If it is a side effect of beginning progesterone therapy, how long can I expect it to last before it goes away? This is very distressing for me, so I hope to hear back from you soon. Thank you very much for all you do.
Jun 15, 2011
 Natural Progesterone Side Effects
by: Wray

Hi Tammy If you have developed a yeast infection it doesn't surprise me. It's not from the progesterone, but from oestrogen. When first using progesterone, particularly if amounts of 20-40mg/day are used, it stimulates oestrogen. This increases the glycogen in the vagina, off which the yeast feeds. It's essential to make progesterone the dominant hormone, this effectively suppresses excess oestrogen, which in turn would lower the glycogen. Oestrogen is also an inflammatory hormone, so the vagina is less able to defend itself against pathogens. We do have a page on Candida which explains this and more. Plus giving a list of nutrients that help against it. Please make sure you use sufficient progesterone, I recommend 100-200mg/day. We do have more info on our page How to use progesterone cream. If you are using a low amount and wish to increase, please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance first. This can occur and is disconcerting if it does. Thanks for the kind words! Take care Wray
Jun 16, 2011
 Natural Progesterone in later life!
by: Felicity

What are the benefits of using Natural Progesterone during later life, e.g., aged 60 and beyond? Is it safe, and are there any positive health benefits?
Jun 16, 2011
 Depo shot
by: Tammy

I am 42 yrs old, and have taken the depo shot for 10 or more years (convenient). Symptoms: night sweats and chills, feeling of worthlessness, worrying about crazy things, burning eyes and lids, heart palpitations, bloating, probably many others. No period for several years, just a touch of spotting here and there. Sore breasts every few weeks. Is this due to the shot? Will N Prog. help? And should I get my period when using this? I have purchased some about 1 1/2 wk ago. Systoms seem a little better. Using about 50mg I believe. Any advice welcomed. Have not had a shot since February.
Jun 17, 2011
 Using Progest Cream for 20 years
by: Theresa

I met Dr. Lee over 20 years ago. I started using Progest Cream for PMS symptoms, ie: swollen, painful breasts, mood swings, etc. All PMS symptoms cleared up in less than 2 months. Now 20 years later and in post menopause for 10 years, I still use the cream daily, stopping for 1 week out of a month. I have never experienced a hot flash or other menopausal symptoms.

Dr. Lee suggested women use this cream even beyond 60 years old. What are your suggestions for continued use?
Jun 20, 2011
 Progesterone and PCOS
by: Andrea

Wray,

I started Natural Progesterone to bring on my period....Also, I have PCOS and heard it was good for this too. I use the cream morning and night. I used the first month for 14 days then stopped to bring on period...it came a week later. I started a new cycle of Progesterone on day 14 through 28. It is now day 58 of the second cycle on Progesterone, but no period yet. I have felt like I would start my period for weeks now, but no period. Also, I have all signs of pregnancy, but negative preg. test. Can you help me understand what is going on. Forgot to mention I am TTC..

Thank you for your help!
Jun 21, 2011
 Myoma
by: Evora

Hello there, thank you for all the info, which l admit confuses me quite a bit. I am living in Europe (38)and we do not get the P cream without prescription.. But my problem is different: for the second time a myoma is growing (had a surgery 2006) right now it is 14mm. My gyn told me it is because of too little progesterone and l got 3 injections every 3 months. I gained weight, lost libido (the bit l had before) and l can not get clean (sort of light bleeding the whole month).. One month untill the next injection... I am not sure l want it but a new surgery is also no option... Any suggestions?

Thank you for helping!!
Regards from CE!
Evora
Jun 22, 2011
 Natural Progesterone in later life!
by: Wray

Hi Felicity Where to begin?! I believe there are benefits, many studies have found it helps prevent neurodegeneration, within the brain too, including the ageing brain. It helps the skin, sleep, it's an anxiolytic, an excellent analgesic, and more, see here, here, here, here and here. I think above all for me, it suppresses the action of oestrogen, testosterone too. There are now over 100 oestrogen mimics in the environment, androgen mimics too. See the website Our Stolen Future. Plus the menopausal ovary is an androgen producing organ, see here. One reason so many in late peri-menopause and in menopause gain weight, loose scalp hair, gain facial hair, see here, here, here, here, here here, here, here, here and here. So I won't be stopping it! Take care Wray
Jun 22, 2011
 Depo shot
by: Wray

Hi Tammy All Contraceptives come with potential adverse side effects. Unfortunately provera is one of the worst. The only safe contraceptive is the copper T IUD, also very convenient, in fact more so as it only needs replacing every few years. The progesterone will have an uphill battle if you continue to use the shots, but I see you stopped in Feb. I'm pleased you're feeling better, but don't believe you're using enough. I recommend 100-200mg/day, dependant on symptoms. You might find the 50mg is enough, but please be aware of Oestrogen Dominance as this can occur if too low an amount is used, particularly if oestrogen is high. You should start getting periods again, 42 is rather young to go into menopause, although not unheard of. If you do they could be erratic, as you are either in the beginning stages of Peri-menopause, or almost there. This page explains how to use progesterone when in P-M. P-M starts anything from 5 to 10 years before menopause, the average age of this is 51. Take care Wray
Jun 22, 2011
 Using Progest Cream for 20 years
by: Wray

Hi Theresa I never met him, but did hear him talk a few times, excellent speaker and a wonderfully compassionate man. I'm delighted to hear how progesterone has helped you. Starting as long ago as you did, the low amount you've been using has worked. Unfortunately most women write to me with very severe symptoms, which I've found only respond to high levels. I agree completely with Dr Lee and using progesterone beyond 60, I for one will not stop! Please will you read all those papers I gave Felicity entitled 'Natural Progesterone in later life!', she also asked the same question. I think they will reassure you. Take care Wray
Jun 22, 2011
 Progesterone and PCOS
by: Wray

Hi Andrea Progesterone is essential for PCOS, but it's not the whole answer. PCOS is an inflammatory disorder, often a lack of vitamin D is behind it. This is a potent anti-inflammatory, as is progesterone. Both are needed for ovulation too. The pregnancy symptoms are actually Oestrogen Dominance. This often occurs when first using progesterone, this page explains why they do. We do have a page on Pregnancy too, but it's essential to reverse the PCOS first. Please read through our page on PCOS, it gives a list of nutrients which all help. But above all, please have a vitamin D test done. For more info on testing please see the Vitamin D Council and GrassrootsHealth websites. Take care Wray
Jun 22, 2011
 Myoma
by: Wray

Hi Evora We supply many women in Europe with progesterone, men too, so it shouldn't be a problem for you. Your gyn is right, too little progesterone doesn't help. Fibroids are an inflammatory disorder, and are exacerbated by oestrogen, an inflammatory hormone. What concerns me is the injection you're getting. Are you sure it's progesterone and not a progestin? Progesterone injections need to be given daily, as levels drop within 13 hours. It sounds like it's a progestin you've been given, which they always confuse with progesterone! In fact it's probably Provera, often called a depo shot. Please find this out, and if so stop them. Progesterone increases libido, does not cause weight gain, and certainly doesn't cause continual bleeding. To read more about the adverse side effects of progestins, please see our page on Contraceptives. As you live in Central Europe, I would imagine you are deficient in vitamin D, please have a test done. Vitamin D is a potent anti-inflammatory, and a lack is often behind the inflammatory disorders. For more info on testing, please see the Vitamin D Council and GrassrootsHealth websites. For more info on progesterone, please see our page How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Jun 24, 2011
 Progesterone and PCOS
by: Andrea

Wray,

Thank you so much for your response. I will definitley take your advice. One last question....What can I do at this point to correct the oestrogen dominance? The symptoms are really harsh and I have had them for weeks thinking I would start my period....Should I start progesterone again? Just let me know what you think. Again, thank you so much for all of the help!
Jun 25, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, I have commented a few times now about not getting my period, I have a few questions for you. I am the woman who is 37 years old, had normal periods until starting Natpro, then had 2 months heavy periods, 1 month normal, now 2 months, going on 3 with no period at all. My question is can I take the cream without stopping & still get a period?? (meaning not cycling it right now), also, how much cream will cause your body to think it is pregnant, and then not produce my period?? Is it safe for my body to not have had a period for 2 months now, possibly 3?? I have had light spotting last month, when I would have normally gotten it & now this month, only a tiny bit of spotting, but still no period. I did try stopping the cream all together last month & felt quite a few estrogen dominance symptoms.I guess what I am asking is, are there other women who take the cream all month & still get regular periods, or should I try to lower my amount in the leutal phase this month & then increase it the 12-14 days before when my next cycle comes?? I just want to make sure this no period is not causing my uterine lining to thicken each month I do not get it. I am really desperate for your advice. I dont really feel I can stop the cream all together right now, but I also really need to get a period. I am really looking forward to hearing from you, Jackie
Jun 26, 2011
 Rash and Itching caused by progesterone
by: Rhonda Hutchison

I have been on a naturally compounded 200 mg progesterone pill for two months. I have in the last week broken out with a rash on my back and abdomen and I was wondering if there was a connection between the rash and the progesterone since about an hour after I took it last night I experienced a lot of itching where the rash is.
Jun 27, 2011
 Progesterone and PCOS
by: Wray

Hi Andrea Yes I think it a good idea to start the progesterone again. In fact as you're having difficulties, I suggest you use it daily, ignoring any bleeding which might occur. Do this for 2 to 3 months, or until you feel stable enough to start following your cycle again. The page I gave you on PCOS has info on how to begin following the cycle, and our page on How to use progesterone cream. But please have that vitamin D test done! Take care Wray
Jun 28, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie As you've discovered progesterone can upset the cycle, there's no way anyone can tell how they'll react to it. Some never have problems. The 2 months of heavy periods shows progesterone was 'cleaning' out the uterus. Evidently your lining had built up over the preceding months. But you were making insufficient progesterone to cause all of it to come away. It's only when progesterone levels drop at the end of a cycle that we bleed. MMP's are enzymes that break down protein. They play a role in the breakdown of endometrial tissues at the end of the menstrual cycle. Progesterone inhibits their action, until levels drop. Now you have the opposite occurring, as progesterone also suppresses oestrogen, responsible for building the lining. Some women can use very high amounts of progesterone and still get a period, in others it stops. Again there's no way of telling how you will react. As you still get Oestrogen Dominance when you stop, I think you should use the progesterone daily for 2-3 months or more, ignoring any bleeding if it should occur. Once you feel stable, stop the cream, bleeding should occur in a day or two. If adverse symptoms still persist when you stop, it means you're not yet progesterone dominant. In which case continue to use the progesterone daily until you feel you are. It is a case of experimenting, unfortunately there's no easy fix like taking a 'dose' of some drug. It depends on so many factors that influence it, stress for one thing drops levels sharply. You don't mention how much you are using, but I suggest you try 200mg/day and see if that helps. You might like to look at this comment for encouragement, Eve had to use exceptionally high amounts before she felt well enough to reduce them, see here Take care Wray
Jun 28, 2011
 Rash and Itching caused by progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Rhonda It could be you are reacting to some other ingredient in the pill. Oral progesterone is the least effective Delivery system. This page also gives details on the possible contents of the pill you're taking. The other possibility is oestrogen dermatitis, see here. This often occurs naturally in women the few days prior to bleeding. It's caused by an imbalance between the progesterone and oestrogen. They both drop, but often the ratios become skewed. Initially supplemental progesterone stimulates oestrogen which rises, hence the adverse effects many women experience when first using it. For more info on this see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. I would suggest changing to a delivery system which allows the progesterone to be absorbed well. Most of the oral progesterone is destroyed by the gut and liver. This means it's virtually impossible to get the level high enough to make progesterone dominant. We do have more info on our page How to use progesterone. Take care Wray
Jun 28, 2011
 Natural Progesterone in Later Life!!
by: Felicity

Many thanks for your helpful reply, and links to all the articles. I have one more question - do I apply the cream continually, or still three weeks on and one off?
Jun 29, 2011
 Natural Progesterone in Later Life!!
by: Wray

Hi Felicity Glad they were of help. It's up to you if you wish to take a break or not. I've not had one for 15 years now, it's easier to remember to use it daily! Although I have run out on occasion, and this makes me realise I still need it. Take care Wray
Jun 29, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray thank you for replying to my questions about "No period", I forgot to ask in my last query, how long does it take, once I have stopped the progesterone cream, for my levels of progesterone in my body to come down enough to get a period?? (Would it take a while if I had been using 200-250 mg/ Natpro, for 2-3 months)?? Also you had attatched a link to a womam named Eve,(and her story of using progesterone cream) but I was not able to connect to it, could you try & put her link back on again for me. I am now going to take between 200-300 mg/Natpro everyday for the next 2 months & see what happens, when I try & stop it, if I get any symptoms or not(& a period). Also, is it possible to still get a period at these amounts?? I also wanted to mention that in the last 2 months, when I was suppose to get a period,I did have some spotting,& alot of pms symptoms(worse than before starting the cream) what does this mean?? Anyway, thank you so much for your support & encouragement, I will keep you posted as to what happens. Jackie
Jul 04, 2011
 It's Simple - Use the Correct Dose
by: Joy Lewis

I have read this thread with great interest and amazement.

I am 55 years old and have been using natural progesterone for about 7 years now and all I can say is that I regret not having discovered it sooner, so many of my problems would have been avoided had I known sooner. I will continue to use progesterone for the rest of my life, in fact, I want to be buried with it!!!

It's very clear from Wray's repeated advise to use nothing less than 100mg/200mg per day depending on the symptoms - half dose in the morning and the remainder at night to maintain progesterone levels. If you do not use this amount it will not work and one could experience symptoms as mentioned in this thread. It's simple, use the correct dose to begin with.

To Wray, thank you for saving my life!! I thank God each day that I found you. THANK YOU for caring and for your good and accurate advice!
Jul 07, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie Normally the drop is quick and within a day or two of stopping the progesterone you should bleed. I'm glad you're going to use it daily for a few cycles, as you said you still got oestrogen dominance when you stop, evidence that progesterone was not yet dominant. Sorry about the missing link, I've given it again here. There are three more comments from high users you might like to read too, see here, here and here. It is still possible to get periods while on high amounts, but they can be erratic. The PMS symptoms are evidence again that your oestrogen is too high, progesterone too low. If you find they occur next cycle, please increase the amount you're using during those few days. Although the amount you say you're going to try should stop them. And please do keep in touch, it not only helps me, but helps others too. Take care Wray
Jul 07, 2011
 It's Simple - Use the Correct Dose
by: Wray

Hi Joy Bless you for the kind words!! I love your wish to be buried with it, so do I! And thanks for repeating what I ask people to do, to use enough. This is so essential. If symptoms are severe far more is needed to overcome them. One reason why over 1200mg/day is given to traumatic brain injury victims, they need it. Incidentally over 70% are men! Take care Wray
Jul 12, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Jackie

Hi Wray, this is Jackie the woman who had no period for a few months, well I followed your advice(and the advice of my friend Annette, who is taking really high amounts) & started taking higher amounts of Natpro (about 300/day, sometimes 400/day), and low & behold, after 10 days on higher amounts, I got a full period..yah!! I was taking about 150/day before this, so I realize now that I needed higher amounts in order for my cycle to begin again, (I beleive I had high amounts of estrogen in my blood, stopping ,my cycle, anyway, I am staying on around 300/day for the next month or two & I will see what happens. I am very thankfull for all your help with women & their hormone imbalances. Bless you, and I hope this blog helps other women who possibly have experienced the same as I have.
Jackie
Jul 18, 2011
 "No Period"
by: Wray

Hi Jackie I'm so happy you trusted my advice and that of Annette, she is always full of sound advice. And yes she is using huge amounts, but obviously they're needed. Certainly no harm will come of it. As you've probably seen in the comment above and elsewhere, I often mention the TBI victims being given over 1200mg/day via IV transfusion. Do let us know how you fare, and bless you for the kind words. Take care Wray
Jul 20, 2011
 so much for happy hormone
by: Anonymous

Finger swelling, rapid heart beat, sore breast and the feeling that I am a train wreck ready to happen. I cried for 4 hrs at work off of one dose. I wouldnt give this to anyone suicidal! And that was a low dose of bioidentical cream.
Jul 27, 2011
 Progesterone Dominance?
by: Anonymous

Can natural progesterone cream help with progesterone dominance? I am well into the peri menopause with very intermittent periods and bad night sweats and general difficulty in sleeping. I'm feeling exhausted due to lack of sleep. Also, my legs ache terribly at night. I had a saliva hormone test recently and the results were 0.4 pg/ml Estradiol and 30 pg/ml Progesterone. The accompanying report said progesterone was normal but estradiol was very low. Should I take bio-identical estrogens or progesterone to ease my symptoms? I will be grateful for any advice as I'm at my wit's end with this.
Thanks.
Aug 02, 2011
 confused
by: indianmom

Hello- I did the diagnos-tech saliva test & blood work after discussing with my dr my symptoms of 60 pound wt gain in 1 yr, aching body-lower portion worse! Fatigue, cravings etc. Low vit d, low b12, low t3, high candida, estrone normal(30), estradiol elevated (17), PROGESTERONE low (22), free testosterone normal (19). Dr has me on pregnenlone, cod liver oil, isocort, caprystatin, vitd, methylcobalamin, progesterone drops(under the tongue). What are your thoughts? This is all so confusing.
Aug 05, 2011
 So much for happy hormone
by: Wray

Hi there I can only assume you were given a low amount of 20-40mg/day and you were not warned about Oestrogen Dominance. All the symptoms you've described are caused by progesterone initially stimulating oestrogen. It can be alarming if you haven't been warned first. Oestrogen causes water retention, progesterone is such a good diuretic it's now given via IV transfusion to brain trauma victims. This shows how safe it is, see here and here. Oestrogen causes prolongation of the QT interval, which results in palpitations, arrhythmia and Torsades de Pointes. Whereas progesterone shortens the QT interval, see here, here, here, here and here. Oestrogen is an proliferative and inflammatory hormone, so causing fibrocystic breasts and mastodynia, progesterone is an anti-inflammatory, see here, here, here, here, here and here. If you'd like to see how progesterone should be used, please see our page on How to use progesterone cream Take care Wray
Aug 05, 2011
 so much for happy hormone
by: Wray

Hi there I can only assume you were given a low amount of 20-40mg/day and you were not warned about Oestrogen Dominance. All the symptoms you've described are caused by progesterone initially stimulating oestrogen. It can be alarming if you haven't been warned first. Oestrogen causes water retention, progesterone is such a good diuretic it's now given via IV transfusion to brain trauma victims. This shows how safe it is, see here and here. Oestrogen causes prolongation of the QT interval, which results in palpitations, arrhythmia and Torsades de Pointes. Whereas progesterone shortens the QT interval, see here, here, here, here and here. Oestrogen is an proliferative and inflammatory hormone, so causing fibrocystic breasts and mastodynia, progesterone is an anti-inflammatory, see here, here, here, here, here and here. If you'd like to see how progesterone should be used, please see our page on How to use progesterone cream Take care Wray
Aug 05, 2011
 Progesterone Dominance?
by: Wray

Hi there You don't have progesterone dominance, your ratio of progesterone to oestrogen is only 75:1. From Saliva Tests we run, we've found it should be 600:1 and over. Your symptoms all point to low progesterone in ratio to oestrogen too. I've found 400mg/day progesterone is needed to reduce or stop hot flushes or night sweats. It normally takes a few days to achieve this, then the amount should be reduced slowly. Oestrogen is an inflammatory hormone, progesterone is anti-inflammatory, so your aching legs should ease. I recommend 100-200mg/day, or more if symptoms are severe. But please read our page on Oestrogen Dominance first. This can occur when first using progesterone. We do have more info on our Peri-menopause page. Take care Wray
Aug 05, 2011
 confused
by: Wray

Hi there Your symptoms point to low progesterone, and to low vitamin D. I can understand the low vitamin D, it's so prevalent in India. I see no point in the pregnenolone, it is the precursor to progesterone but also to DHEA. There's no way of telling which way the conversion will go, besides adding an extra burden to the body in it's conversion. Cod liver oil should be avoided as it contains too much vitamin A, this impacts on vitamin D, see here. Isocort is good, I take it thinks you have adrenal stress? Progesterone is excellent for this, as the adrenals first have to produce it, before converting it to cortisol. If stressed they rob other sources, notably ovarian. This then upsets the reproductive system, in fact stress can stop ovulation, which then lowers the progesterone level sharply. I also take it you have a candida problem, hence the caprylic acid. To my mind this product is not strong enough, it only contains 100mg caprylic acid. I always recommend caprylic/capric triglycerides, often called MCT oil. It's an extract of coconut oil, containing 60% caprylic acid and 40% capric acid. I suggest taking 5ml of this, which will give 3000mg caprylic acid. It is safe to go up to 60ml/day, or more, but it does have a laxative effect if too much is taken. But higher doses are not dangerous in any way. Please make sure you are taking at least 5000iu's per day or more of vitamin D. And get your level to 70-100ng/ml, and not the 30ng/ml the labs and doctors use as a cut off point. For more info see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth and Birmingham Hospital websites. The B12 is good, as that too is low in Indian women, but mainly if they are vegetarians, see here and here. And finally progesterone is best absorbed via injections, suppositories and creams. Much of the progesterone can be swallowed if taken via the mouth, so I never recommend oral, sublingual drops or troches. We do have more info on our Delivery systems page. For more info on How to use progesterone, please read through this page. It can be very confusing! Take care Wray
Aug 15, 2011
 STOP!!
by: Anonymous

I just had a malignant breast tumor removed. It was positive for progesterone 66%, estrogen 56%. (I realize the % doesn't = 100). My bioidentical compounded progesterone was doubled in strength by my doctor 8 months ago. I had all of the side effects of too much progesterone - but ignored. I have taken bioidenticals for 5 yrs. Unless you have an informed physician who is capable of monitoring this treatment...don't do it. By the way, I feel much better being off of the hormones. I would never recommend this again!!!!!!!!!
Aug 18, 2011
 STOP!!
by: Wray

Hi there I'm sorry you had breast cancer, but being positive for progesterone doesn't mean it caused it. You say you had taken bio-identical hormones for 5 years, did this also include oestrogen? And you say you had taken it, which I assume means oral progesterone? If this is the case, most gets destroyed in the gut and liver, it's the least effective Delivery system. You also don't say how much progesterone you were using, as low amounts stimulate oestrogen. If you feel better being off the hormones, I can only assume you have excess oestrogen, and the progesterone was stimulating it. There are no studies showing it causes cancer, but many showing it can help. See our page on Cancer and progesterone. It's been used safely for over 60 years now. Interestingly upregulated dopaminergic activity is known to reduce the risk of cancer. One paper saying ' Evidence for the impact of upregulated dopamine on tumour prevention includes...the virtual suppression of all cancers during pregnancy (when dopamine synthesis increases)', see here.
Progesterone increases during pregnancy, but progesterone also increases dopaminergic activity and neurons too, see here. You might be interested to read that giving progesterone ten to thirteen days prior to surgery to remove a cancerous lump, reduces E2-induced proliferation of normal breast epithelial cells. That having a progesterone positive tumour is in fact a good thing, see here. Another interesting fact, Tamoxifen is often given after breast cancer surgery. But research has found only those with >75% progesterone positive cancer showed any response to it, and had an improved recurrence free survival too, see here. I'm running out of space so will start a new comment below. Take care Wray
Aug 18, 2011
 STOP!!
by: Wray

Hi there A lack of vitamin D is behind over 20 cancers, and a lack of vitamin D reduces the benefits of progesterone. Please have a test done, for more info see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth and Birmingham Hospital websites. Plus these papers on cancer here, here, here, here and here. Take care Wray
Aug 18, 2011
 Response to Progesterone Related Cancer
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray, I am just responding to the comment in regards to the woman who had progesterone related caner, could you please explain how progesterone related cancer works. Is it due to the fact that a woman has too much progesterone in her body?? Or is because the woman has too much bad estrogen, which in turn creates a stimulus of progesterone (bad) if there is such a thing?? I was just wondering about the natural progesterone we take & how this affects a woman & if our bodies can get too much progesterone?? Thus causing progesterone related cancer, please clarify how this works, if you could?? Another thought I had is, could a woman get progesterone related cancer by having took synthetic (HRT) progestins & thus cause progesterone related cancer?? Just looking for your input?? Thanks
Aug 19, 2011
 Response to Progesterone Related Cancer
by: Wray

Hi there I see your comment was posted on the same day I posted my answer to her. I do hope it explains it well enough for you. But the bottom line is, if you have cancer, it's always an advantage if it's progesterone positive. Take care Wray
Aug 21, 2011
 Progesterone related cancer
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray, I got your response & what I really was wondering is if you can get progesterone related cancer from taking too much biotentical progesteronce cream (Natpro)?? Or if it is from the stimulation of too much estrogen, thus causing the progesterone receptors to cause the cancer?? I just am not sure I totally understand?? Thanks for explaining
Aug 22, 2011
 Progesterone related cancer
by: Wray

Hi there No you can't get cancer from using too much progesterone, or making it for that matter. We produce over 400ng/ml in the third trimester of pregnancy. If progesterone caused cancer, virtually all pregnant women would get it. Many women are given it too after IVF, and for the duration of their pregnancy, they too would get cancer if progesterone caused it. Dr Dalton would prescribe amounts of 800mg/day for her patients with PMS etc, and up to 2400mg/day for those with post natal psychosis. There is not one study showing progesterone causes cancer, but the reverse. Did you have a chance to look at the papers on our cancer page? And no, the progesterone receptors don't cause cancer, it's oestrogen which causes mitosis and cellular proliferation. Progesterone stops mitosis and causes differentiation. Progesterone only stimulates oestrogen in the initial stages of using it. Which is why I recommend using amounts far higher than other people, to prevent adverse symptoms occurring. Take care Wray
Sep 06, 2011
 new progesterone user
by: Anonymous

Good day, I am 60 years old and post menopausal. I have been using Femigel for years and my doctor has insisted that I use progesterone as well so am using Solal progesterone cream. I am feeling tired, can't sleep, getting irritable and wondering if I really need to be on both? without the Femigel the only problem I have is constant hot flushes, need advice please!
Sep 08, 2011
 new progesterone user
by: Wray

Hi there I don't believe any women needs more oestrogen, even after menopause we continue to make it in our fat cells. But these don't make progesterone, unfortunately! You might like to read our page on HRT which explains the dangers of oestrogen. I don't know how much progesterone you are using, as you don't say, but it would appear too little, as the symptoms you have are caused by Oestrogen Dominance. We do have a distributor in SA who could give you advice, please contact her via her website here. You'll find a link on the site to her email. Take care Wray
Sep 26, 2011
 Help with Progesterone Choice
by: Cindy

Hi. I want to buy a natural progesterone cream within the week but don't know which one to buy. I have read many of the comments above and one women experienced shortness of breath, tight throat, anxiety, etc with the cream. I am having those symptoms and am not on anything. I don't want more symptoms. Which one should I buy? Dr. Lee's book lists many. HELP PLEASE!!!!!
Oct 01, 2011
 Week one on natural progesterone cream
by: RON

I am 49 years old male and have been using natural progesterone cream for about 7 days now and have no problems but will iIstart to grow breasts?
Oct 05, 2011
 Help with Progesterone Choice
by: Wray

Hi Cindy You've asked me a difficult question, as I would naturally say the one we make ourselves. The ingredients are simple, it contains more progesterone than most makes, it's as natural as we can make it, and we know it works from Saliva Tests we run. These are done for us by a naturopath in the UK, who's prescribed it for 15 years now. You have evidently not read the links I've given to all the above women on Oestrogen Dominance. And the fact they were all using too little progesterone. It's the 20-40mg/day amounts which cause all the problems. It's essential to make progesterone the dominant hormone, this can only be done with high amounts. I suggest 100-200mg/day, more if symptoms are severe. We do have more info our our page How to use progesterone cream. For encouragement you might like to read these comments from users of high amounts here, here, here and here. Take care Wray
Oct 05, 2011
 Week one on natural progesterone cream
by: Wray

Hi Ron No you will not, the reverse in fact. We do have a page on Moobs, as they seem to be called. Please read through the page, it gives an explanation on why they occur. You might like to read these comments from other men here, here and here. Take care Wray
Oct 05, 2011
 Awful taste
by: HeyMa

In july I began progesterone drops under the tongue. Used 2 times daily for 3 weeks then off 1 week. The drops give me an awful taste in my mouth and I'm sure my breath is bad. My tongue has kind of a odd sensation-almost like taste buds are a bit off. What are your thoughts on drops vs tablet or creams.
Oct 07, 2011
 New Progesterone User
by: Joy (South Africa)

To Anonymous - your post dated 6 September refers. I am the distributor that Wray is referring to, if I can help you at all please contact me via my website - Wray has given you my link. I look forward to hearing from you.
Take care.
Oct 07, 2011
 Awful Taste
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi HeyMa
Whilst I can't help you with progesterone drops as I do not know how much progesterone they contain, I can tell you that the best way to use progesterone is via creams, injections and suppositories. Personally I prefer the cream as it can be use all over the body. Tablets are no good at all as 70% of the pregesterone is destroyed in the gut and liver. Depending on symptoms, nothing less than 100mg should be used a day.

I am sure that Wray will advise you further on progesterone drops and whether this is infact causing your bad breath. Take care.
Oct 21, 2011
 Wrong calculations of percentage
by: Anonymous

75 mg/g is not 75%, but 7.5%.

Calculations; 1g=1000 mg
7.5 mg/1000 mg x100% = 7.5%.

Please do not scare people in vain.
Oct 22, 2011
 Awful taste
by: Wray

Hi HeyMa As Joy says, drops are not the best Delivery system, most of it being destroyed. Progesterone is very bitter, but I'm not aware it would make your breath bad. Agreeing with Joy again, I prefer a cream, it's well absorbed and can be applied anywhere. There's more info on the link I've given above. Take care Wray
Oct 22, 2011
 Wrong calculations of percentage
by: Wray

Hi there I have looked back through the entire page and can't see what comment you are referring to. Whoever made the error, I'm sure did it by mistake and their intention was not to scare people. There isn't a day that goes by when I have to explain the difference between ml, g and tsp. Take care Wray
Oct 26, 2011
 progesterone cream/hypothyroid
by: Anonymous

have been using progesterone cream for 6months.before starting the cream i had severehypothyroid symptims despite normal tsh,t3,t4 levels. estrogen dominance,caused thyroid hormones to be innefictive.saliva progesterone level extremly low. gained 20lbs., hair shedding, extreme fatigue, sleeping 12hours aday,periods every 15 days,acne,depression.went to a doc who specalized in bioidenticals. put on compounded progesterone cream,what a difference! low progesterone effects thyroid. 2 previous docs and an endo said nothing wrong. must be stress related! guess they were misinformed!
Nov 07, 2011
 Soy Allergy
by: Rachelle

Hi Wray. I see that a question was asked about a soy allergy but I didn't see a response to the question. I tried natural progesterone several years ago but discontinued it immediately because I had not been forewarned about the possibility of estrogen dominance symptoms occuring. I was taking a capsule which I now know after reading through the blog probably only exacerbated my symptoms due to low amounts getting absorbed. I could have made it through the scary initial symptoms I experienced if only I had known to expect them! I am very sensitive to soy and I am wondering if Natpro contains any soy, particularly in the vitamin E as this vitamin is often derived from soy and can cause me major problems. What I am really hoping is that my soy "allergy" will be helped greatly by becoming progesterone dominant. I cannot thank you enough for this site and your compassionate blog! I have learned a great deal from you already.
Nov 09, 2011
 progesterone cream/hypothyroid
by: Wray

Hi there I'm so pleased you've found a doctor who understands progesterone, and what it can do to us if too low. And what oestrogen can do if too high. Interestingly if stressed, progesterone levels drop, pity the other docs knew nothing about this! I do hope you've been warned about Oestrogen Dominance, as this can occur out of the blue and is very disconcerting if it does. We do have more info on these pages on How to use progesterone cream, Peri-menopause and Menopause. Take care Wray
Nov 09, 2011
 Soy Allergy
by: Wray

Hi Rachelle Bless you for the kind words! So many people are not warned about Oestrogen Dominance, it's shocking really, as it hits you out of the blue, when you are expecting to feel better. There is no soy in Natpro, the progesterone is derived from the yam, and the vitamin E we use is synthesised. There are two kinds of vitamin E, one has in vivo properties which cannot be used as an antioxidant in creams. But it's the one we take as it has antioxidant actions in the body. The other has in vitro properties, which is the one we use, as it does have an antioxidant effect in skin creams. I would hope you do become more tolerant of allergens, interestingly oestrogen makes us more sensitive to them. But contrarily, I hope your soy allergy stays with you! It's a good indicator of when you've eaten it inadvertently, it's not a good food! And is found in so many, supplements too. I've just replied to someone who's oestrogen level had increased substantially, in spite of using progesterone twice a day. I asked her to check everything she ate or drank. It turned out the omega 3 caps she was taking contained it, plus one supplement had lecithin in it, see here. I'm very sensitive to sulphur dioxide, I get a very itchy eczema on my hands. It's in everything, including wine which I love, but now avoid, even the organic wines. Vinegar too, why on earth put a preservative into a preservative?! I can't eat dried fruit either, that's disastrous, so I now dry my own. So if I get itchy hands I know I must avoid whatever it is I've eaten or drunk, although I now look at all labels. For more info on soy see here. Take care Wray
Nov 15, 2011
 Please Help me
by: Barbara

I have been to three bioidentical hormone doctors and it has been a horrible. I have been put on creams and now drops. I am so dizzy, gaining weight all over and now my hair is falling out. Also headaches. I am understanding that you are saying increase or hang in there it will pass. Well, I cannot function from holding my head up, to driving a car. I have also been told eat what ever you want because you will never lose weight with your labs. DO you know what that sounds like to a person wo eats no sugar, nothing white, low cabs and soduim reads every level? I can,t be the only one. Please
Nov 17, 2011
 Please Help me
by: Wray

Hi Barbara It would appear you have been given very low amounts by each doctor, unfortunately you don't say, so I can't help much. And often they add oestrogen and testosterone too, which doesn't help at all, in fact the reverse. But you don't say what the composition of the creams and drops are. Finally I don't know what you mean by "you will never lose weight with your labs". Maybe you could let me know the answers and I'll then be able to advise. Take care Wray
Nov 17, 2011
 Tender breasts
by: HeyMa

I'm currently on estrogen cream & progesterone drop & testoterone cream. Lately my breasts have become very sore, feel "full" & tender. Is this common with any of the above? I had used an estrogen likecream for years, maybe estradial?? But my dr wanted me to stop that and use an estrogen cream. Been using it for several months, but this tenderness has only been 1 month or so. I would appreciate any comments.
Nov 17, 2011
 "How long till symptoms decrease"
by: Anonymous

HI Wray, I have been taking between 300-400mg of Natpro for about 4 months now & this month my period has been going for aprox. 14 days, is this normal & also how long can I stay taking this amount of cream? I still get some estrogen dominance symptoms when I try to lower it, in fact that is when I started to have my period again, I just want to know it is ok to take this amount & be safe, and also should I try to lower it after I am done this cycle? And how much can I lower it by? Thanks for the info. & your advice in this. Also, I read the blog about soy & realized after looking at ingredients, that I too was taking in soy, which will now STOP!!
Nov 17, 2011
 Please Help Me
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi Barbara - all your symptoms indicate that you are experiencing Estrogen Dominance sypmptoms and not using enough progesterone. How much are you uisng each day? Nothing less than 100mg should be taken but what is most important is how much progesterone does the tube of cream that you are using contain? For example:

The correct amount for a 60g tube/tub is 2000mg of progesterone, anything less and it will not work unless you increase the amount. Perhaps you could reply giving the amount your cream contains.

Your weight gain etc is due to not using enough progesterone. You should be using 100mg to 200mg a day and not all at once, the dose should be divided and used in the morning and again at night.

Also how long have you been using the cream for? On the correct dose, it can take anything from 1 to 6 months depending on symptoms for results to be noticed.

Cream, suppositories and injections are the best methods of using progesterone, so much is destroyed but the gut and liver when using drops and pills.

I hope that this helps until Wray is able to respond.
Nov 22, 2011
 Tender breasts
by: Wray

Hi HeyMa Oestrogen causes inflammation and water retention, both these can cause sore breasts. I would suggest you stop the oestrogen cream, and only use progesterone. But please use sufficient, I recommend 100-200mg/day, as I've found anything less doesn't work as well. And can in fact make matters worse. For more info see our page on How to use progesterone cream No woman should be given testosterone, see here, here, here, here, here here, here, here, here and here. Sore breasts can be caused by lack of iodine, see here, here, here and here. An easy way to find out if the level is low is to get a tincture of iodine. Put 3 drops anywhere on the inner arm, rubbing them in with the dropper. If the patch fades in a few hours it means there's a deficiency. Continue applying it until the patch takes days to fade. Alternatively have a blood test. Take care Wray
Nov 22, 2011
 "How long till symptoms decrease"
by: Wray

Hi there You have been using a very good amount. Unfortunately for many women it can take some time before oestrogen is lowered sufficiently for it not to bother us. I've known women who have had to use it for 6-12 months before they can reduce the amount. For encouragement you might like to see these comments here, here, here, here and here. It is safe to se high amounts for a long time. When you do reduce only lower the progesterone by about 16mg/day, which is about 1/2ml, a tiny amount. Stay on this until you feel stable, then reduce again. Continue like this until you find the optimum amount. If you lower it too much you will get a period, not that this is of any concern, but as you found symptoms can come back. It must be reduced very slowly. And I'm delighted you read about the dangers of soy, there's more info on this excellent site here. Please have a vitamin D test done, often a lack of this adversely affects progesterone. In fact studies on TBI victims have found a lack reduces the benefits of progesterone. For more info on testing etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth Birmingham Hospital and Vitamin D Links websites. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml or 175-250nmol/L and not the 30ng/ml or 75nmol/L most labs and doctors regard as adequate. And the minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although the latest research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. Take care Wray
Nov 22, 2011
 Please Help Me
by: Wray

Hi Joy Thanks for your support! Take care Wray
Nov 28, 2011
 3 months and still having symptoms
by: Meg

I have been using Natural Progesterone for 3 months now and I was hoping my symptoms would decrease by now. Since starting the cream my breast size has increased almost a full cup size and my breast have become very tender and painful especially near the armpit. I have gained a few pounds. However, I chalk that up to increased breast size. My menstrual cramps have not lessened either. There are also a couple of days out of the month that I feel very anxious, since beginning the cream. A positive effect has been that my cyclical migraines have vanished. I am still experiencing quite a bit of hair thinning though. My main concern is the breast pain. I apply the cream twice per day (two pumps morning and 2 pumps at night). Any advice would be grateful.
Dec 13, 2011
 Suzanne Somers Please Help Find A Doctor For Me
by: Beth

I am 43 years old and have had so many" Hormonal "problems for what seems forever. I have been to countless Doctors and Emergency rooms.i have read Suzannes books and had my AHA moment while reading one of her books.I took progesterone after my bloodwork came back and it was low. The first month I took the progesterone I felt fantastic. The second month was like my body had leveled off. Suzanne if you are out there please respond I am willing to do whatever it takes to feel like I did those first two months
Dec 14, 2011
 3 months and still having symptoms
by: Wray

Hi Meg It appears you are using too little progesterone. You might have noticed my advice to others to use 100-200mg/day. The pump containers normally give about 20mg/pump, which means you're getting about 80mg/day. Using too low an amount of progesterone causes Oestrogen Dominance. I'm pleased the migraines have gone, progesterone does help them, see here, here, here, here, here and here. Please try increasing the amount you use, rubbing it on the sore breasts in particular. The weight gain is usually water retention, which is caused by oestrogen, see here. Initially progesterone stimulates oestrogen, which is why it's important to use enough to stop this. Take care Wray
Dec 15, 2011
 Suzanne Somers Please Help Find A Doctor For Me
by: Wray

Hi Beth I don't know if Suzanne will find your query here, but maybe I can help you. It appears you were using too small an amount of progesterone. If it was an over the counter cream, it was probably a low strength, and the recommended amount was 20mg, maybe 40mg/day. I recommend 100-200mg/day, or more if symptoms are bad. We do have more info on our page How to use progesterone cream. You were lucky your body 'leveled' off, many women experience severe Oestrogen Dominance when using low amounts of progesterone. Please consider using far more progesterone than you were, I'm always here to help you through any ups and downs. Take a look at the other comments on the site too, they should give you a better understanding of progesterone therapy. Take care Wray
Jan 18, 2012
 SUPER CONFUSED
by: Anonymous

I am currently 39 yrs.old. Menstrual cycle went from 26 dys to 21 dys and then 19 dy cycles over the last 3 yrs.
I started gaining weight, having mood swings, anxiety, etc. My hormone tests showed estrogen dominance, HIGH vit D, low T3, Rx 100mg of bioidentical progesterone to be taken nightly starting at day 7-21. Does this sound right? Ive been taking it for the past 5 mos and ive gotten MORE irritable, MORE weight gain, especially in hips and stomach. To be honest, im terrified to increase the dosage although my levels are still showing low progesterone. Estrogen levels have come down according to lastest test. I cant gain any more weight and the depression is all consuming! Im thinking of discontinuing it all together to see if my body will balance itself out on its own.
Any advice?
Jan 19, 2012
 SUPER CONFUSED
by: Wray

Hi there Oral progesterone is the least effective Delivery system. Most of it gets destroyed by the gut and liver before a small amount enters the circulation. It should always be used a minimum of twice a day too, as levels drop after about 13 hours. As your cycle is now about 21 days, you have been told to use it at the correct time. Ovulation occurs in all women, irrespective of the length of the cycle, 12-14 days before bleeding. So you should be ovulating ± day 7. It's the low amount of progesterone entering your system which is causing the increase in problems. It doesn't surprise me your levels still show low. Please change to a delivery system which allows for full absorption, there's info on the link I gave you. I recommend 100-200mg/day, as I've found low levels exacerbate existing symptoms, or can make them worse, as it has with you. Using sufficient overcomes the Oestrogen Dominance. We have more info on our page How to use progesterone. Take care Wray
Jan 25, 2012
 Side effects from oral progesterone
by: Anonymous

I was taking 100mg of oral progesterone for peri menopausal symptoms, progesterone low on saliva and blood tests. I was taking it continuously for 30 days. After 2 weeks I complained to my doctor about being so tired lethargy, and depression. He said try 50mg. I wanted to finish what I had ordered (100mg) and took it for 2 more weeks. I had a really heavy period, felt awful, had a huge anxiety attack and depression, difficulty concentrating. I stopped the progesterone but how long will it take for me to feel any better? I
Jan 26, 2012
 Side effects from oral progesterone
by: Wray

Hi there Oral progesterone is not the best Delivery system, in fact I feel it should not be given at all. It only gives progesterone a bad name. The problem being it's mostly destroyed in the gut and liver, leaving little to circulate. This small amount is enough to stimulate oestrogen, hence all your adverse symptoms. We have more info on our Oestrogen Dominance page. I recommend 100-200mg/day, or more if symptoms are bad. But in a form which is absorbed well, oral is not. By stopping it, it will not make you feel any better as you already have Peri-menopause symptoms. The idea is to get rid of these, and this is only possible with a much higher amount. You might like to see the results of Saliva Tests we run. You'll notice how well the progesterone is absorbed, but more to the point, all the women were feeling well once using it. Please consider using either suppositories or a cream, you will get the full benefit of the progesterone, and your P-M symptoms will go. Take care Wray
Jan 26, 2012
 Side effect from oral progesterone
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi Anonymous!! As Wray has mentioned in the post above and many other posts, oral progesterone is not the best delivery. 70% is destroyed in the gut and liver. Please revert to Wray’s link on this above. So your 100mg of oral progesterone would not have been nearly enough to help you. Nothing more than 100mg of the correct amount of progesterone is required. For your symptom 200mg would have helped you. By reducing to 50mg would merely have aggravated estrogen and caused a ‘war’ between the two hormones.

30 days is not nearly enough for symptoms of any kind to be felt. Hot Flushes can clear up within a month though.

In all probability you will not feel any better because you are estrogen dominant and this is what is causing your symptoms. It is important to make progesterone the dominant hormone before everything falls into place. This can take anything from 1 to 6 months.

Hope this has helped a little but I am sure that Wray will explain further.

Take care.
Jan 26, 2012
 Side effect from oral progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Joy Thanks for your support! Take care Wray
Feb 06, 2012
 Does Progesterone cause ligament laxity?
by: Kate

I have had some major back pain and other dominance symptoms since the birth of our fourth child (emergency C section due to severe previa) and subsequent tubal ligation. All doctors and PTs believe it is si joint/ligament laxity which causes instability. After trying Emerita progesterone at 20-30 mg a day for about 2 cycles, I was sleeping well, night sweats were gone, focus and energy were back but back pain was horrible.

Can progesterone therapy cause ligament laxity? I don't need anymore laxity. I can't find anything about this?
Feb 08, 2012
 Does Progesterone cause ligament laxity?
by: Wray

Hi Kate This study found no evidence of either oestrogen or progesterone involved in joint laxity during the cycle, see here. But this study did, see here, and as they state, it was associated with greater oestrogen levels. And this one showed no relationship during pregnancy, see here. But it seems to me you have PTLS (Post Tubal Ligation Syndrome), your symptoms fit, see here. Progesterone is an excellent anti-inflammatory, in fact so good it's now used for TBI victims. It's also an excellent diuretic too, so prevents any oedema forming after the injury. I recommend a far higher amount, 100-200mg/day or more if symptoms are severe. I also suggest rubbing it directly on the site of the pain. We do have more info on our page How to use progesterone cream. If you should consider increasing the amount, please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance first. Take care Wray
Feb 23, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Anonymous

Hi, I'm 47 and have just started with Solal natural progesterone cream. To give you a bit of history - I had recurring ovarian cysts for a number of years. The cysts would grow then decrease in size which is apparently quite normal. Then i started taking Breast Assured natural breast enhancement capsules/cream over a period of 9 months. I gained a HUGE amount of weight while on these tablets, and a whole lot of cellulite! My breasts did increase in size and fullness but so did my entire body. Then my gynae discovered that my ovarian cyst had grown over the acceptable level and needed to be removed immediately (i was suffering from abdominal cramps). I had an op to remove my one ovary which put me into immediate surgical menopause (I was not menstruating for about 3 years prior to this due to a physcological trauma). I started experiencing mood swings, night sweats, low libido, hair loss, itchy skin, sagging (ageing skin) and weight sitting around my middle. I tried all kinds of diet and exercise to get rid of the weight and NOTHING helped. My FSH test was extremely high (menopause) and my estrogen low. What i dont understand is that the Breast Assured pills contained phytoestrogens, so surely my estrogen levels should have been higher? Anyways, i started taking Fenugreek tincture to increase my estrogen. I sort of felt better for awhile then not, so i added Red Clover to my list. Within 24 hours of my first dose of RedClover i lost a whole bunch of hair which gave me a big fright. I lowered the dose from 10 drops to 5 drops per day and the hair loss stopped. Then i came across the benefits of natural progesterone and have been taking the Solal (i think its 30mg) twice a day. I immediately felt better - i slept properly for the first time in many years, i feel much more calm (i was having terrible palps and anxiety before taking it), my skin looks more youthful, my scalp is no longer burning and shedding and my libido has increased slightly - this all in a period of 7 days. I suspect i'm estrogen dominant so cant understand why i did not feel worse before feeling better?? Also, i'm not sure if i should continue taking the Fenugreek and RedClover together with the progesterone??
Feb 24, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Wray

Hi there Pity about the breast assured as it's full of phytoestrogens. These have an oestrogenic affect, and would have caused not only a breast increase, but weight increase, and caused your cyst to grow. There was no need to have had your ovary removed. Stopping the product and using about 400mg/day progesterone would have reversed it all. All oestrogens, whatever form they come in, cause the proliferation of hormonally sensitive tissue. This includes the breasts, subcutaneous fat, uterus and ovaries. In post menopausal women oestradial ranges from 0 - 30 pg/ml, it should be low. The menopause oestrogen, oestrone, is never tested for. Our fat cells continue to make this till we die. Phytoestrogens are not tested for either. Red clover is another phytoestrogen, I would never recommend it. So is fenugreek. We do have a page on Hair Loss you might like to look through. I'm delighted the progesterone helped you. But the amount of progesterone you're using is to my mind too low. I recommend 100-200mg/day, more if symptoms are bad. Unfortunately Oestrogen Dominance can occur out of the blue. So please watch for it and increase the amount you're using substantially if it does occur. We do have a page on Menopause which has more info. Finally we do have a distributor in SA who could give you advice, if you'd like to contact her, please do so via her website here. Take care Wray
Feb 24, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi Anonymous! I would like to share my story with you. But first, you are not using enough progesterone. Nothing less than 100mg to 200mg possibly more is needed. So you need to use 2 to 3 times the amount of Solal that you are currently using to achieve positive results. For your symptoms 200mg would be the amount to look at, then once you feel stable you could SLOWLY reduce to 100mg. The golden rule is to never use less that 100mg a day as that is the amount that is required.

I too started on Solal and it worked like a charm for about 3 months then all my symptoms returned. It's only because of what i know today that I realise why they returned, I was not using enough. I did a search on the internet and found Natpro, started using that and I have never looked back.

The symptoms that you describe are very clearly estrogen dominance and you need to make progesterone the dominant hormone before things start to settle down. Using too little will cause a war between estrogen and progesterone and the symptoms are not pleasant at all.

I can't comment on the fenugreek and red clover as quite frankly since using the correct amount of progesterone and vitamin D I don't need to use anything else. Will be intereting to read what Wray has to say in this regard.

Take care.
Feb 27, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Anonymous

Thanks so much for your replies.
I've read that Fenugreek contains a compound called diosgenin that converts it to estrogen or progesterone, whichever is needed, and therefore balances the hormones. Is this true? I also thought at first it was a phytoestrogen, but on the bottle (tincture) is states it helps with hair loss.
The Solal cream is bioidentical, composition 30mg/ml. One pump is 1 ml so i'm actually using 60mg per day. I will double this to 120mg and see what happens. Although the scale does not show any weight loss, i definitely look and feel lighter/thinner. I'm not sure if the weight is just shifing back to where it was before or what, but my clothes are fitting much better around my middle. As i said before the burning scalp issue has stopped and only normal hair fall. I'm still waiting for new hair to grow in. The greatest improvement has been in my mood - no more feeling like i've turned into a raving phsycotic lunatic! I don't know how my husband put up with me before :( My skin has stopped itching and is glowing once again. One thing i have found though is that i have quite a bit of "loose" skin on my body. I'm not sure if this is due to the breast assured and now the progesterone reversal of that? I suffered through "swelly belly" after my ovary was removed - looked like i was 5 month pregnant with "water in my tissues".... that slowly seems to be disappearing now with using the progesterone cream. I have been sleeping much better (thank goodness!) and my depression seems to be lifting. I will up my dose and see if the improvements are achieved faster.
Feb 27, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Anonymous

I've decided to take Joy's advice and add 1000iU Vit D supplement daily. I was shocked to find that the price is almost double that of the Progesterone cream (also Solal brand). It's pricey. I cannot take fish oils as i have ITP (auto immune low platelets).
My routine will be:
Morning: 60mg progesterone cream
500iU Vit D tablet
1000mg Flaxseed (Omega 3,6,9)
1 tablet Centrum over 50 Multivitamin
Evening: 60mg progesterone cream
600iU Vit D tablet
1000mg Flaxseed (Omega 3,6,9)
Evening Primrose oil on face and neck

One question i need answered: If all is going well with 120mg progesterone cream, do i continue indefinitely at this dose. If all is not going well and I need to up it to 240mg per day, how long do i continue at the higher dose i.e. at what point will i know when to reduce the dose to maintain everything at an optimal level? I saw someone else ask this question and didn't see the answer. Surely once everything is perfect one should try to lower the dose due to expense??
Feb 28, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Wray

Hi there Fenugreek does contain diosgenin, and this sterol is used to synthesise progesterone, but only in a lab. The body cannot convert it into any human steroid, be it progesterone or oestrogen. I know how you feel about the raving psychotic monster, I was one too! Progesterone does stop itching, as it inhibits mast cell secretions, see here. Progesterone is an excellent diuretic, so good it's now given to Traumatic Brain Injury victims to prevent oedema forming. It could be this is the reason for the loose skin, it would definitely be the reason for the water in your tissues going. I suggest you use the cream on your face, rather than the evening primrose oil, it's excellent for skin, see here. I've used it there for 15 years now, morning and evening, on my neck and breasts too. All autoimmune disorders have low vitamin D, please have a test done, and get your level up high. The minimum daily dose is 5000iu's, if low 10,000iu's is needed. Even in sunny South Africa levels are low in most people, as we spend 80-90% of our time indoors now. How much progesterone and for how long is a question I get asked constantly, and the answer is I simply don't know. Each of us has different requirements, our food, sunlight hours, pollution, excess oestrogen and more all have a bearing on it. Stress plays a big role as levels drop, so more is always needed. How stressed is a person, I can't answer that either, only the individual can. So it's trial and error, and using progesterone as and when needed, increasing or decreasing according to symptoms. We have often been asked to put our cream in a pump dispenser, but it limits the amount. We have men using 10mg/day, or a third of your pump. One man I know uses 400mg/day, or 13 pumps. We also have women using 1000mg/day which would require 33 pumps. So if the 120mg/day is not helping, there's no need to go as high as 240mg, you could try 180mg, which is about the amount I use daily. It's a balance between cost and turning into a psychotic monster! Please do contact Joy, I gave you her website, but here it is again. I'm appalled at the cost of the vitamin D, Joy can advise you on that too. Plus give you any number of papers on it, the progesterone too. Take care Wray
Feb 28, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Anonymous

OK wow, I'm definitely going to try it on my face.

Update: Last night was my first "double dose" of the cream (60 mg). I immediately felt worse - rapid heart beat, anxiety, hot flushes, feeling jittery, breathing problems (short breathes). I had terrible insomnia last night ... the worst in a long time.
This morning was my 2nd double dose. Not as bad as last night ... still some shortness of breathe and heart pulpitations and jittery feeling. Around 10.30am i took a dose of Cayenne Pepper (quarter teaspoon in a little warm water) - what a difference! All symptoms disappeared immediately and i felt like i was "floating in a lovely relaxing place" lol. Now around 3pm the symptoms are slowly coming back. I will persevere.
Feb 28, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Wray

Hi there Yes is wonderful for the face. Unfortunately you will feel worse, but it does calm down! All those symptoms you've described come from oestrogen. The rapid heart beat, anxiety, jitteriness and the breathing problems. Progesterone is vial for respiration, it expands lung volume and relaxes airways, whereas oestrogen constricts smooth muscle. I'm most intrigued the cayenne helped, I must remember that! Take care Wray
Feb 29, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Anonymous

Cayenne Pepper normalises blood pressure which i think is what helps with the heart palpitations. I've used the cream all over my body no problems and last night used it on my face - felt a hot stinging sensation for about 30 minutes, almost like an acid burn which then went away. My skin felt nice and "plumped". Symptoms were much less last night ....seems i'm adapting to the higher dose quickly :) Still have some shortness of breathe after this mornings dose, and also a headache for the first time since increasing the dosage. I will take another dose of Cayenne Pepper later this morning.
Feb 29, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Anonymous

I think i'm going to add Taurine supplement to my routine, especially as my Platelet count is very low.
Feb 29, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Wray

Hi there Well thanks for telling me that, I love it in a hot drink, and knew of it's anti-inflammatory effects, but not that. Taurine is the most remarkable amino, a potent antioxidant, it goes into all our complexes. Vital for the heart, eyes, liver, in fact any tissue that has high oxidation. I take it every day in a complex, plus adding more. Stops my calf cramps, I used to take magnesium for this, but taurine is also an osmolyte, controlling the electrolytes. Evidently I needed it, rather than the magnesium. It's not found in any veggie, nuts or seeds, only animal protein. Do you have idiopathic thrombocytopenic purpura? If so you might be interested in this paper here. It's very long, so if you don't want to read it all, do 'control find' and enter 'ITP', and you'll be taken to the reference. If you do have ITP you must increase your vitamin D to about 10,000iu's per day. I know you said it was a huge cost, so please contact Joy for info on a cheaper form. Take care Wray
Feb 29, 2012
 endometriosis
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray,i was diagnosed with stage four endo two years ago its quite widespread. They have tried to put me on various different contraceptives which i have awful side effects to all of them including at the moment the mirena coil horrendous leg pains and tingling feeling. i would like to know if natural progesterone would help my endo in anyway and reduce menstual bleeding etc?? i am now considering trying the copper coil and the cream!! any advice would be very much appreciated,many thanks karen
Mar 01, 2012
 endometriosis
by: Wray

Hi Karen It doesn't surprise me you had awful side effects from the Contraceptives! If you have Endometriosis your oestrogen is high and your progesterone low. The pill makes it drop even further, as it prevents ovulation. As for the Mirena, I better not get started on that, but you might like to see these comments here which speak for themselves. Progesterone does help endo, but I've found amounts of 500mg/day are needed if severe pain and bleeding occurs. We do have a page on the Menstruation Cycle which explains the heavy bleeding. Large amounts of antioxidants are needed for endo, as it's caused by oxidative stress, and exacerbated by excess oestrogen. We have a list of these here. Please have a vitamin D test done, it's a most potent antioxidant, always low in inflammatory disorders. For more info on vitamin D levels, testing etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth, Birmingham Hospital and Vitamin D Links websites. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml or 175-250nmol/L and not the 30ng/ml or 75nmol/L most labs and doctors regard as adequate. The minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although the latest research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. Take care Wray
Mar 01, 2012
 Endometriosis
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi Karen - please whatever you do STAY AWAY from ALL contraceptives particularly the Mirena, it is one of the worst. Dreadful stuff, all of them.

Good luck.
Mar 02, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Anonymous

Yes i have ITP (autoimmune).

I have included Taurine (1000mg) a day into my routine.

For the past 2 - 3 days I've been feeling FABULOUS!!! Very very slight shortness of breathe but hardly noticeable.

I've also notice some weight loss around my neck/shoulders/chest area.
Mar 03, 2012
 Courious
by: Marshe'

Hi,

For about 2 hrs I have been reading through all the post and feel a little anxious by what I have read.

When I was 23 I had a complete hysterectomy due to stage 3 endometriosis after battling that for 3 yrs and 4 abnormal paps my dr found cervical cancers cells.

2 yrs ago and after 15 yrs of synthectic hormones my body decided NO more. I had gone to my dr and begged for help only to hear I needed antidepressants. I knew in my heart something was wrong and that is when I found bioidenticial hormones and I LOVE them. When the dr read the results of my blood work I cried out of fear. Today was my pellet day but lately I have been tired and not sleeping well so my dr asked if I would try compounded Progesterone but, after reading this I am a little concerned. I do believe it is a capsules but can not recall the mgs and I will take it at night. I do take natural Thyroid and 2400iu's of vit D and I take Adderall XR 15.

Please help. I do not want to gain weight or become irritable.

Kind Regards
Mar 03, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Wray

Hi there I'm so delighted about this! Please, please increase your vitamin D if you have ITP. I feel you should get your level up to 100ng/ml. And please have a test done, this is so important, because if your level is too low, it won't do anything to help. The 1000iu's you're now taking is not doing anything either. Please!! Take care Wray
Mar 07, 2012
 PROGESTRONE AND ESTROGEN PATCHES
by: Ann

Hi, I am 69 years old, had a complete hysterectomy at 32. I have been on Estrogen for all these years with NO HOT FLASHES or side effects......My GYN decided last year because I complained of dryness in the vagina and feeling very nervous that I needed to add Natural Progestrone which I get at a special pharmacy and the cost is 55.00 per month. I don't have any side effects with this cream but wondered if anyone else is using the Climara patch 0.05 mg and progestrone cream? Please advise....
Mar 10, 2012
 PROGESTRONE AND ESTROGEN PATCHES
by: Wray

Hi Ann I can't tell you if anyone else is using HRT and progesterone. Although I do know many who have gone off the HRT, preferring to use the progesterone only. The cream you are using is very expensive! And how much have you been told to use, I recommend 100-200mg/day dependant on symptoms. We do have more info on our Menopause page. In case you do have side effects, as they can come out of the blue, please see our page on Oestrogen Dominance. Take care Wray
Mar 19, 2012
 No sure HRT is good
by: Anonymous

I have started on BHRT about a month and a half ago, and I do not think it does any good to my body. I am taking testosterone cream, estradiol 1.5 mg, thyroid 1g 100 mg, dhea 25 mg, and progesterone 100 mg, vitamin D, and fish oil. I felt uneasy that my doctor prescribed thyroid even my thyroid level was not that low, but I am 50 going thru menopause, and thought the doc might know better. You always should trust your guts. Since starting taking these meds I have experienced more side effects and feel worse than I was before taking all that stuff: nausea, feeling tired and sleepy all the time, bloated, dizzy, when walking my heart is pulping like crazy, weak, my doc keeps saying that some are temp effects but after month and a half i do not think so. How to safely get off this therapy? I am confident it does not do any good for me
Mar 20, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Anonymous

Just to give you an update - I've been feeling great on the progesterone only cream. My hair is growing back slowly but surely too. However, these negative things started to slowly creep in:
1) Dry ageing facial skin (after using the cream on my face for about 2 weeks - looked better in the beginning then got worse).
2) Facial hair starting to grow (fine white hairs on cheeks, chin and upper lip).
3) Cellulite on legs - bad - very bad!

I've started back on the Fenugreek drops - 10 drops 3 times a day to see if this makes any difference. I've also cut back on the progesterone cream to 60g twice a day.
Mar 21, 2012
 Not sure HRT is good
by: Wray

Hi there It doesn't surprise me you don't feel good. Testosterone should never be given to a woman, see here, here, here, here, here here, here, here, here and here. I don't believe we need extra oestrogen either, particularly oestradiol. Please see our page on HRT. Prescribing unnecessary drugs is pointless and can have adverse affects, so I see no reason to tamper with your thyroid if it was fine. DHEA shouldn't be given to a woman either, see here, here, here and here. So that leaves only progesterone, which has no adverse side effects, and has been used safely for over 60 years now. I recommend 100-200mg/day or more if symptoms are severe. So although you were on the lowest amount I suggest, it would have had an uphill battle against all those other hormones. And would have barely had any effect. I feel you would need about 200mg/day, possible more, to counter all those symptoms you have. If you wish to try only progesterone, please see our pages on Peri-menopause and Menopause. But please read our page on Oestrogen Dominance first. Continued below.
Mar 21, 2012
 Not sure HRT is good Part 2
by: Wray

Hi there I'm pleased you're taking vitamin D, it's such a vital nutrient. For more info on vitamin D levels, testing etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth, Birmingham Hospital and Vitamin D Links websites. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml or 175-250nmol/L and not the 30ng/ml or 75nmol/L most labs and doctors regard as adequate. The minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although the latest research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. A lack of vitamin D reduces the benefits of progesterone, you might like to see these comments here. Incidentally a lack also affects the thyroid, see here, here and here. Take care Wray
Mar 22, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi there Feeling Better - sorry don't know your name! I noticed that you are using Solal/Solatech progesterone cream, well I am not surprised that you are having these adverse effects. It does not contain the correct amount of progesterone to make it work for you.

Let me tell you my story. At the age of 48 my menopausal/peri-menopausal symptoms arrived all due to stress!! I had always decided that I would never go the HRT and thanks to an amazing book - now tagged as my Bible - called the Wisdom of Menopause by Dr Christiane Northrup, I decided that natural progesterone was the route I was going to follow. I started to us Solal and it worked like a charm for 3 months, then my symptoms returned so badly that I thought I was dying. I did some research and came across this website which changed my life!!! After only one month on the correct amount of progesterone my symptoms had cleared up and they have not returned since, that was 6 years ago. I do however increase my dose when confronted with stressful situations. Vitamin D has also helped my greatly, I will never stop using both of them.

Solal only contains 1500mg of progesterone in a 50g container meaning it has 30mg of progesterone per ml. You need to be looking at 33.3mg per ml before it will work. Or you could use extra Solal resulting in added expense.

You have now reduced your dose to 120mg/day so you will very definitely experience adverse effects and then begin to think that progesterone is not the answer, when in actual fact it is IF the correct amount is used. All reports are now showing that to overcome these terrible effects to start using 400mg/day until the symptoms ease up and you begin to feel stable enough to reduce SLOWLY i.e. 1/2ml at a time. If you reduce to soon and too fast your symptoms will return.

It is as simple as that. You will not regret increasing to 400mg/day should you decide to do this but quite frankly it is the only way to sort this out once and for all.

Hope this helps and good luck.

Mar 23, 2012
 Feeling Better
by: Anonymous

Thanks Joy.
It was while on 120mg that the following symptoms started:

1) Dry ageing facial skin (after using the cream on my face for about 2 weeks - looked better in the beginning then got worse).
2) Facial hair starting to grow (fine white hairs on cheeks, chin and upper lip).
3) Cellulite on legs - bad - very bad!

It was due to this that I cut back the dose. Now i must increase it?

I've stopped with the Fenugreek (took it only for 2 days) as I immediately experienced hair fall. I've now also purchased the Solal "Skin hormones" which is a blend of progesterone, estradol and estriadol to use on my face in the hopes it will work better (it says the formula is too weak to be absorbed by the body and it remains only in the skin). I've also started taking 2000mg MSM per day.
Mar 27, 2012
 Feeling better
by: Wray

Hi there Please clarify something for me, as looking back over your comments, you say you were using 60mg am and 60mg pm. Above you say you are cutting back to 60mg twice a day. So did you increase beyond that? I don't understand about the dry facial skin, as I've used it there for 15 years now, and mine is fine. I don't know what the other ingredients in the cream are that could be affecting it, maybe you could look at them? The facial hair indicates free testosterone has risen, you need to increase the amount of progesterone. Progesterone increases levels of SHBG, if this is low free testosterone rises. If bound to SHBG it becomes inactive, see here. Please avoid all sugars, even those found in all grains, legumes, sweet starchy fruit or veggies, and dairy. Fructose, sucrose and glucose decrease SHBG by 80, 50 and 40% respectively, see here. This allows free testosterone to rise. Cellulite only occurs in women, and overweight men. I have no definitive proof, but it appears highly likely oestrogen is the culprit. It's a mitogen causing cells to proliferate, including fat cells, these are also a source of oestrogen, so a vicious cycle starts. It also causes water retention, so the tissues swell with water. The two combined play havoc with us! Are you still taking only 1000iu's vitamin D per day? If so please increase it to at least 10,000iu's, a lack of this impacts every cell, plus you have ITP. You really need to get your level up to at least 100ng/ml. Plus a lack reduces the benefits of progesterone. Many women have found on getting their vitamin D levels up, symptoms which won't resolve do, see here. In an earlier post you said 'i started taking Fenugreek tincture to increase my estrogen. I sort of felt better for awhile then not, so i added Red Clover to my list. Within 24 hours of my first dose of RedClover i lost a whole bunch of hair which gave me a big fright.' I don't know why you want to increase your oestrogen again? Besides you said after a while you didn't feel so good. I feel you need to increase both the progesterone and the vitamin D. But please have a vitamin D test done. Take care Wray
Apr 19, 2012
 I am confused about the amount
by: LB

I am very thankful for the information here, but confused about the amount of Progesterone cream to use. The recommendation is 100-200mg per day, but the typical dosage in creams is 20mg. Does that mean that we use 10 times the dosage daily and a 30 day jar or tube of cream will now least only 3 days instead of 30 days?
Apr 20, 2012
 I am confused about the amount
by: Wray

Hi there Thanks for the kind words and I don't blame you for being confused! I do recommend far higher amounts than most, as I've found that low amounts do not help. And often make matters worse by causing Oestrogen Dominance symptoms. In fact we do have a page on Progesterone Misconceptions which I actually wrote in defence of my argument. Some of the creams are very low strength so will be used up quickly. We do have a page on How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Apr 26, 2012
 Is taking progesterone at 57 ok?
by: Sue

Just scanning all the comments and felt like adding a bit.... I'm a basically healthy 57 year old female, 5'4", 125 lbs soaking wet, who has never had a night sweat or any of the 'normal' stuff related to menopause except for some breast tenderness, mood swings and a little irregular periods for the past two years.. yes, I still experience them almost regularly. [Now, I can understand why our ancestors had so many children!]

I've had mitral valve prolaspe since forever (diag at 18) and was put on atenolol for irregular heartbeat in 1996 after going thru the stress of my 9 1/2 year old being diagnosed with Burkitt's Lymphoma... (Praise God - he's fine!!)

Three different doctors suggested progesterone hormone cream, which I used religiously... then experienced a tender lump in my breast which they diagnosed as scar tissue from breast feeding (3 kids and 6 years of nursing = lots of mastitis).

I stopped using the natural drops, to see if the lump would diminish, which it has, but is still under surveilance. With the 'few' symptoms I now have, I'm wondering if I need to continue the drops, which gave me back my eyelashes, helped decrease that wonderful chin hair, increase my head hair and helped greatly with the stinkin full-face-headaches with migraine type symptoms. Aside from the craving of the need to kill for chocolate!

I went on the Mediterranean-type diet, which shed 20 pounds almost overnight, and gave me back energy I didn't think was possible. [When I got down to 108, the kids said I was too thin... so gladly ate to gain some back! haha]

The question is PROGESTERONE.... GOOD OR BAD? My dad is 97, his sister is 93, their mother was 101 and I would like to join their ranks, with longetivity in my blood - literally.

Suggestions and comments glady sought! My currect doctor barely gives me 10 minutes, when I make my annual visit and there is only one female doc in my area. Thanks a million for posting, to share and compre.

Best to everyone....
Apr 27, 2012
 how long can you use progesterone?
by: Anonymous

Hi, I just wanted to ask how long can a woman stay on 300-400 of the natpro cream per day?? I have been on this amount for over 1 year & am wondering if it is safe to continue on these amounts for a long period of time?? When I lower the cream to 100-200/day, I get back strong estrogen dominance, thank you.
Apr 27, 2012
 Is taking progesterone at 57 ok?
by: Wray

Hi Sue Amazingly it appears you're still in Peri-menopause! The irregular cycles suggesting towards the end. It's evident the amount of progesterone you were using was very low, unless you have an iodine deficiency, Breast Tenderness is usually caused by excess oestrogen, and/or low progesterone. Low levels stimulate oestrogen, so when stopping the progesterone the 'lump' would diminish. We also have a page on Breast Cysts which explain why they occur. Facial hair is a sign testosterone is higher than normal, this is often the case with women in P-M. Progesterone does suppress it, and many women have found it wonderful for hair, on the head! As for the headaches, progesterone can help those too, but sufficient must be used, see here, here, here, here, here, here, here and here. A lack of vitamin D also causes migraines, see here, here and here. Progesterone is definitely good! I would see how you get on during the following months having stopped it. You'll soon know if you should try it again. Continued below.
Apr 27, 2012
 Is taking progesterone at 57 ok? Part 2
by: Wray

Hi Sue You're so lucky not to have gained weight as so many women do. So much so they blame the progesterone and stop using it. You do have a long lived family! I would say they kept their blood glucose stable. All the studies on long lived groups have found nothing in common with their food types, but all had stable blood glucose, see here,here, here, here, here and here. There's more info on the Paleo Diet site, the link is on our Nutrition page. Take care Wray
Apr 27, 2012
 how long can you use progesterone?
by: Wray

Hi there It is safe, but costly! Have you tried reducing very slowly, maybe you're lowering it too fast? I suggest no more than 16mg per reduction, and staying on that for a few days before reducing further. 16mg is 1/2ml or 10th of a teaspoon. Please avoid all foods which contain phytoestrogens, as these could be contributing to the symptoms, see here. Check your skin care products too, as these often contain oestrogenic chemicals, see the Skin Deep website. Please have a vitamin D test done, a lack of vitamin D reduces the benefits of progesterone. For more info on vitamin D levels, test kits etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth, Birmingham Hospital and Vitamin D Links websites. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml or 175-250nmol/L and not the 30ng/ml or 75nmol/L most labs and doctors regard as adequate. The minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although the latest research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. Many women have found symptoms resolve, in spite of high amounts of progesterone, once they get their vitamin D levels up, see here. Take care Wray
Jul 15, 2012
 Bio-Est & Progesterone
by: Ann

Hi, I've been on Bio-Est and Prog for 2 yrs and had hot flashes day & night until 7 months ago when my Dr changed my script. I liked taking Estrogen only, because my hot flashes disappeared, but I became estrogen dominate and developed changing cells. I'm 57 and stopped having periods for 1 yr when this took place. I bled for 3 wks and was given a progestin to correct it. We changed my script to 1.25 mg bio-est in the morn, and 1.25 bio-est w/50mg progestone at bedtime. That too caused changing cells. I've added OTC Progesta-Care (20 mg natural progesterone) cream at bedtime. Is my est/prog ratio Ok? My Dr doesn't understand Bio-Est well enough to discuss this and I'm having to self-diagnose and treat, it seems. Please help.
Jul 17, 2012
 Bio-Est & Progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Ann I've found 400mg/day progesterone and over are needed to stop Hot Flushes. Once gone the progesterone can be reduced to the optimal amount. I don't believe any of us need extra oestrogen, for the reasons you give above. We get too much as it is with all the oestrogen mimics in the environment now, see Our Stolen Future. Using progesterone with oestrogen will only mean it has an extra battle to suppress it. It's essential to use progesterone twice a day too, as levels begin dropping after about 13 hours. You are currently using about 70mg/day which I don't think is enough, please consider increasing it. We do have a page on Menopause which has more info. The ratio of P:E2 is normally done if blood or saliva tests are run, not on the amount of hormone used. Do you have your test results, if so you could work it out, or I can for you. Take care Wray
Sep 14, 2012
 Progesterone and Insomnia
by: Amy

Hi- I am on my third night of inserting 100mg natural progesterone vaginally. I had terrible sleep the first 2 nights and insomnia last night. I was told prior to taking that I was on the verge of being estrogen dominant. Do you think this is the problem? That the progesterone has pushed me into estrogen dominance cause excitability and insomnia? Should I take this in the morning as opposed to the evening? I need energy during the day, not night! My friend is doing same protocol and it makes her sleep! What's up?
Thank you!
Sep 14, 2012
 Progesterone and Insomnia
by: Wray

Hi Amy Yes it has pushed you into it, because I don't believe you are using enough. Although I recommend 100-200mg/day, often more is needed. It really is dependant on symptoms. When first using progesterone it stimulates oestrogen, there's more info on our page about Oestrogen Dominance. Secondly progesterone should be used a minimum of twice a day, as levels begin dropping after about 13 hours. You might like to look through our page on How to use progesterone cream. Evidently the amount your friend is using suits her, and is not causing problems. Most likely because her oestrogen is not as high as yours. Progesterone is very helpful for sleep, see here, here and here. Take care Wray
Sep 14, 2012
 Estradiol
by: Amy

Hi Wray- My Estradiol tests showed a result of 70.6, which she thought was border line estrogen dominant. Is that true?

What do you do to sleep when the progesterone is causing insomnia?

Thank you!
Sep 15, 2012
 Estradiol
by: Wray

Hi Amy If you had a blood test, 70.6 is nowhere near the upper limit, which ranges from 30 - 400 pg/ml. If it was a saliva test it was way over the top, the range is 1.3-3.3 pg/ml. But the amount is not of much help, it's the ratio of P:E2 which is critical. Unfortunately oestrogen dominance can continue for some time, one reason I suggest far higher amounts than most do. So you can either persevere with the amount you are using, or increase it. Tale care Wray
Jan 21, 2013
 soy lecithin or no soy lecithin?
by: Carolyn

I was drawn to this site by its clear explanations, and was ready to buy Natpro till I read that it contained soy lecithin. Then Iread that it did not. Could you explain please?

My M.D. wants me to take Promethium for sleep and cognitive issues, but I've decided to go with a natural progesterone cream instead. The rub is that I'm 80 years old, had 4 chldren, absolutely no problems--none--with menopause, so from this point of view have none of the usual problems with hormones. I do have Hashimoto's, low thyroid. I'm trying to educate myself to be sure not to use anything with soy

I'd appreciate your input.
Jan 23, 2013
 soy lecithin or no soy lecithin?
by: Wray

Hi Carolyn Thanks so much for the kind words. It's so interesting to me you escaped all the hormonal problems so many of us have. And at an increasing rate now too. I'm sure it's because the oestrogen mimics which now abound on the planet, were not so prevalent when you were younger. If interested, the web site Our Stolen Future is extremely good. I am puzzled you found the Natpro contained soy lecithin, as I don't think it's mentioned on the site. Except possibly in reply to a query. We don't use any soy in the cream, the ingredients are as natural as we can find, and can be viewed here. Oral progesterone is the least effective Delivery system. Most of it gets destroyed in the gut and liver, see......"The liver and gut region removed a mean of 96 per cent of the progesterone entering these tissues" see here. Progesterone does help sleep, see here, here and here. Although oral progesterone can help sleep, it doesn't help any other issues. Progesterone can help cognitive problems too. I'm in the middle of doing a web page on memory loss, but it's not finished yet. But I have found a number of nutrients which help. Vitamin D, NAC (N-acetyl cysteine), taurine, glutamine, GABA, tyrosine, chromium, selenium, zinc and the B vitamins....quite a mouthful! But I feel above all these vitamin D could be what you need. It helps sleep, see here and here. Cognition, see here. And Hashi's, see here, here, here and here. I suspect your level is very low, please have a test done. Continued below
Jan 23, 2013
 soy lecithin or no soy lecithin? Part 2
by: Wray

Hi Carolyn For more info on vitamin D levels, test kits etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth and Birmingham Hospital. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml (175-250nmol/L) and not the 30ng/ml (75nmol/L) most labs and doctors regard as adequate. The minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although recent research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. We do have more info about progesterone on our Menopause page. Take care Wray
Jan 24, 2013
 Progesterone outside the usual box
by: Carolyn

Thanks, Wray, for your very useful comments and info (and I look forward to your memory entry). I hadn't thought before about this generation's possible increase in hormonal problems; many of us older ones were lucky, seemingly (though I can think of some of my own bad habits that preceded my hypothyroidism). it wasn't on your site, btw, that I saw references to Natpro and soy lecithin (one that comes to mind had a contrast (it had no evaluations) between Natpro/soy lecithin and yam/Progest.

I'm gobbling up, bit-by-bit, your many pages, interested at this minute, the calm and courteous way you deal with some others' need for advanced degrees to accompany valid and usefulknowledge.

One more btw: some of your outside URLs tell me "no such URL at this domain."
Jan 24, 2013
 Progesterone outside the usual box
by: Wray

Hi Carolyn Ah I see now! Well I'm relieved it wasn't on our site. And there is an explanation. We used to use a non GM soy based progesterone, but no amount of reasoning on my part could persuade people there was no soy in the cream. The assay for the progesterone we get is 99.94% pure! I would also point out that if it was contaminated by soy, or anything else for that matter, it would not get a certificate from the various bodies who dish them out. i.e. it wouldn't have the Ph. Eur. USP, or JP certificate, (European Pharmacopoeia, United States Pharmacopoeia and Japanese Pharmacopoeia). So I gave up, and chose to use a yam based progesterone! Those URLs! The sites change the link, which of course we don't know about. We do use a very useful website that checks for broken links, and sends us the info. So periodically I go through them all and find the new link, it's a bore! You do say the kindest things! I must confess I do find some of the questions couched in aggressive terms, and have been a bit short with the person. But it isn't frequent, and then I get people like you who make up for it! Take care Wray
Mar 20, 2013
 Advice
by: Kristy

Recently went to get hormonal testing through blood and the levels were Progesterone 4.31,
Testereone 35, estradiol 39, vitamin D 25.3, DHEA 74, Free T3 2.9. My doctor prescribed me a progesterone cream, Vitamin B complex, 2000 IU of Vitamin D and Armour 30 MG. Was wondering if this was correct cause Ive been having dryness down there and still feeling tried my irritabilty and moodiness is a little better but I just got off my monthly and it goes away then anyway but then a week later I will start having extreme PMS again. Any advice would be great.
Mar 21, 2013
 Advice
by: Wray

Hi Kristy Your P:E2 ratio is 111:1, not bad compared to some I've seen. Although I feel it should be higher, from Saliva Tests we run we've found it's best if 600:1 and over. You don't say how much progesterone you've been told to use, but if it's anything like the normal amount, it's probably about 20mg/day. I suggest using 100-200mg/day, but it is dependant on symptoms. It's excellent if applied in the vagina, best at night as it leaks out in the day. Your vitamin D is very low, and 2000iu is not going to do anything to your levels. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml (175-250nmol/L) and not the 30ng/ml (75nmol/L) most labs and doctors regard as adequate. The minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although recent research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. For more info on vitamin D levels, test kits etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth and Birmingham Hospital. If you are having to take thyroid meds, then the chances are the lack of vitamin D is affecting them badly, see here, here, here, here, here and here. We do have more info on our page How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray
Mar 24, 2013
 Progesterone Side Effects
by: Carolyn EH

Whew: my first enthusiastic reading in your website didn't begin to touch what I've now read in the Side Effects session. Thanks for this pointer. I'm doubling to two tsps a day, split in two. Watching some of your own videos is also making me wonder about panic attacks and anger in family housemates and possible progesterone needs. Testing talk ahead.
Mar 25, 2013
 Progesterone Side Effects
by: Wray

Hi Carolyn Thanks for looking through the website, and for picking up that it's not progesterone causing those adverse symptoms! But progesterone stimulating oestrogen leading to Oestrogen Dominance. The more oestrogen a woman has the worse the symptoms are, so the amount of progesterone to use is dependant on this. It's not dependant on 'dose'. I've found men can experience the oestrogen dominance too, you can imagine how they feel about that! We do have more info about panic attacks on our Anxiety page, and about anger on our Aggression page. Let me know if doubling the progesterone helps. Take care Wray

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