Wow - this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and others. 46..

by Fiona
(Kirkland, WA)

Just to make sure I am on track, and Wray I would love to pay for some of your guidance, consultation, and/or donation to your site?

I feel so blessed to have found you. Spent the week reading your site for hours. Thank you for your amazing knowledge, of many but especially Wray - Priceless gift! I am pretty sure that Natpro is the direction I need to go.

I am 46, no children, 3 fibroids - largest is 9x9cm (endometrial) small amount of ovarian cysts (endometriosis) on one ovary (as seen on resent MRI) this often clears up after a cycle or two so not fully blown. Lucky.. no real pains, though crazy bleeding just on the 2nd day, period for 7, every 28 days. I am often anemic and take iron supplements and some times IV’s. (right now ferritin 20/iron 24 is pretty good for me)

Diet - mostly paleo, no fruit, and not high protein. I am 138lbs, 5ft 8 (I have put on about 8 lbs with the fibroid in the last 18 months). almost no diary.

last 8 months I have done all kinds of alternative options like; heavy detox, neural therapy/frankenhauser, acupuncture, tinctures of all kinds of remedies; iodine, frankincense and Chinese strong potion teas, mayan stomach massage, lymphatic drainage etc. But none suggested looking at my hormones when it was clearly a hormone issue.

Q. I recently saw another ND, with great hopes for some alternative resolution around hormones. Sadly with all of the protocals they would like me on that would cost about $1000-$1200 a month. They did a saliva test (it was taken within a 3 day window when estrogen would have been highest). See below. The Dr. made the comment that my body was full of estrogen, however results show I am actually really low in all the estrogen markers. The Dr’s response was 'your progesterone level is low on the saliva but the problem is that your estrogen dominant per your body type and the uterine fibroids. The estrogen is not releasing into the saliva instead is being stored in the fibroids promoting inflammation in the uterus. We need to counteract the estrogen in the uterus by increasing progesterone and getting your body to release the stored estrogen.’ She suggested progesterone cream prescribed (50 Mg/progesterone micronized & 100mg of progesterone cream HP).

I supported/volunteered a metabolic Dr answers his online helpline for about 7 years and respect and honor the hours of time you dedicate to this. Though he is not a hormone specialist, MD who does not follow the ’standard of practice’ felt that this was an absurd answer and that if the body were overstored with estrogen then it would have shown in the saliva.

I would love to hear what results others have had with taking progesterone 150 or more - has it helped shrink their fibroids when they were this large? I am also looking in to surgery to remove the fibroids only and scrape the right ovary if needed but would love to avoid this all together.

Estrone saliva am < 5.0
Estradiol 0.2 saliva am
Estriol saliva am <0.1
progesterone saliva am 39.
tester one saliva am 20
melatonin 11.2
cortisol saliva am 0.59 rest of the day ok.
DHEA saliva am 0.21
17-OHP saliva am 11.6

Many thanks..

Comments for Wow - this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and others. 46..

Click here to add your own comments

Jan 26, 2016
Wow - this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and others. 46..
by: Wray

Hi Fiona What a lovely thing to say, bless you! I wish I could give you good news about fibroids but they are sometimes so difficult to reduce that often the only option is surgery. Before you resort to this please see our page on fibroids....
And this most excellent one by Dr West....
Your P : E2 ratio is 1:195, not desperate;y low, but much lower then we recommend from experience. We do have a page on saliva tests you could look through.....
There are so many wonderful people now replying to comments on the site that I'll leave them to add more info. Take care Wray

Jan 26, 2016
serum hormones levels and ratio
by: Tina

Hello, just reading with interest the above comments. Is there a reference range for optimum estrogen/progesterone levels in post menopausal women. What would this be in terms of serum results?
My progesterone was 1 ng/ml and estradiol 11 pg/ml. I was told by 1 Dr. I needed estrogen, and the other said I needed progesterone!
Thanks so much-this is all so v. helpful:-)

Jan 26, 2016
Wow- this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and other. 46..
by: RJ

Hello Fiona!
Wray is God's angel to women seeking good health...she just isn't there for progesterone concerns. Look for Joy also...she's wonderful too. Wray has helped with many more things I and my family have had. You are in the right place to help. If you read my story you will see at your age I was bleeding profusely. I have now been on progesterone for four years..non-stop...unless I run out...and I can honestly say heavy bleeding is in my past and I hope it stays there. Yes, I still bleed. I haven't bled for almost three months now up until two days ago and it started and is flowing as though I was in my 20's again. Knock on wood LOL My only symptom a week ago that showed was tender nipples. Had no clue a period was starting. I just increased the dosage by 100mg to offset it as I have been under a tremendous amount of stress (yes, stress is a big time bother for our hormones) But what has been wonderful for me is there hasn't been any of the awful spotting that goes on forever. Wray has walked me through so much. Our uterus' are unhealthy. They build with estrogen and they hurt and leak or bleed heavy and continuously. I was scared to use the dosages she wanted me on in the beginning but thought what do I have to lose other than more blood. It wasn't until I was over 500mg a day and this was putting it on in small doses throughout the day that I finally saw a decrease in blood...still bled, but it wasn't as heavy. I used to have clots come out of my pant legs it was so bad. I never went out in public...couldn't. So, for the last four years I have been on 300-1,000mg a day, non-stop. Take N-acetyl-cysteine (NAC). She had me work up to 2,000mg a day and I complained so much to her LOL...the diarrhea was so bad. But I persevered and did I am on 1,500mg a day. Oxidative stress likes to form in our uterus' as fibroids. You may be on a regimen for that as it sounds as though you are on a good protocol for the nutrients you need. The only thing that rings in my head is with the heavy bleeding and being anemic you need protein. Our daughter had a stomach full of ulcers and they were bleeding, she was so anemic that it required two blood transfusions and once we got the stomach balance...thank you WRAY!! LOL...we got her on a healthy supply of protein...whey shakes mostly because she really isn't a meat help rebuild what she had lost. My thoughts with the doctor who told you that if you are ED then it would have shown up on your saliva test. Even thin people can get diabetes, it's not just an obese person's issue....I weigh 250...was 300 though. Just because high estrogen doesn't show up doesn't mean the uterus isn't struggling with too much of it in the form of fibroids. I have nothing but praise for Wray and her help to see me and hundreds of others through a very nasty transition in life. I always say lucky the soul who breezes through it. But Fiona 98% of us are all going through some sort of trouble...some worse than others. But for each of us it is a serious problem that we want to fix and/or relieve. I chose to wait when the doctor's assistant told me it's probably cancer lets get it out and I am glad I did. I will continue my protocol and pray the Lord is good to me. Hope your are able to find some relief very soon! has some natural remedies that may be able to help you out also. God Bless! RJ

Jan 28, 2016
fibroids.. and progesterone.. ruptured implant
by: Fiona

how special and heard I feel, thank you ladies, Wray, RJ for your support! Tina I hear you and me too I am a little confused.

Wray, I had read all the links, but still confused by my labs and what to do. Thank you for letting me know 'P : E2 ratio is 1:195, not desperate;y low, but much lower then we recommend from experience' so then should i start taking the progesterone.. ? The ND here already made it up though I asked them to wait, so should i take this first batch of 50 Mg/progesterone micronized & 100mg of progesterone cream HP and then go on to Natpro or should I just not mess around and just start with Natpro. I have never taken hormones before and I have some fear it will knock everything out of balance, but then a little voice keeps saying but maybe I am living with out of balance and what bliss it would be to experience balance that I never knew.
Also RJ, thank you for validating that estrogens can read low but still by high possibly in the fibroid.. as it seemed hearing it from the ND a little nosensicle ;-( so felt doubt I was on the right path. Any guidance as to starting, my period is due in about 7 days, should I just jump in and do it, taking 150 of the mixture I have in hand, more? do I need any other hormones, can I put my head in the sand and pretend this is all a dream!! lol.
To add, I have a ruptured silicone implant that is completly encapsulated that has been there for 25 years.. I am thinking there is a link between the fibroids and the implants and so thinking it is time to get these babies out finally.

feeling pretty scared to make these moves..

Jan 29, 2016
Wow- this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and other. 46..
by: RJ

Hello Fiona!
You are 46 and things are really going to get bumpy, unless you will be one of the fortunate souls to breeze through menopause. but with your symptoms it looks like you are going to go through the same issues as 90% of we women. Taking 150mg a day of progesterone is going to cause more issues for you. It took me 500mg a day, non-stop, divided into four times a day before the bleeding started to somewhat subside. My uterus was unhealthy when I started progesterone. So, not only was I trying to stop the heavy bleed and clotting I was also trying to heal the uterus. So what is going to initially happen is you start progesterone and the bleed and clotting may even get heavier because it is trying to clean out the uterus. I can remember talking with Wray so much because the bleeding just would not stop and finally at one point she had to tell me she just didn't know what to do any longer. I persevered and it finally stopped. That was almost four years ago. I would just take what you have in the amount of 500mg a day to start so you can get rid of it and get Natpro ordered and ready to go. You said you were bleeding in your initial comment are you still? And your normal cycle is coming in seven days? Are your cycles still regular? I know fibroids are hard to get rid of but I can remember that each time I had a child those fibroids and polps would come out because the doctor would show them to me. So, I truly believe with enough progesterone they can come out without childbirth. I also know it's scary. I complained constantly to Wray about increasing. It's that word cancer that gets to all of us. Throwing your hormones out of whack has already taken place or the fibroid and heavy bleeding wouldn't be there. You will find if you read through a good portion of the commentators on the site that most did/do not find relief until they are at that 400-500mg level. Start NAC also. It will help the uterus too. Also look into serrapetase and proteolytic enzymes. They are great at reducing fibrin in our systems. When I was researching for my husband who was thought to have pulmonary fibrosis, I found those two and discovered what fibrosis was. Fibroids may be a buildup of fibrin and/or scar tissue, which can result in fibrosis. God Bless! RJ

Feb 02, 2016
jumping in
by: fiona

Dear RJ,

Thank you for responding, I missed the notice but came looking anyway ;-). I am on my 3rd day of my period, and I run 28 day cycles pretty much like clock work. So I should just start right now and not wait.. boy I am so nervous.. thank you for being there for me. So will jump in and do around 500 how would I know if I am taking too much?

boy belly and boobs.. feeling a little scared with these two pending possible surgeries. Again thank you so much for your support, to me and so many others. I have all kinds of emotions this week, weepy, anxiety, and feeling a little lost. ahhww.. this too shall pass.

Many blessings your way.

Feb 03, 2016
Wow- this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and other. 46..
by: RJ

Hello Fiona!
I would do 500mg a day if you are bleeding heavy and continuously. If you aren't having those issues you may only need 200-300mg a day. It's going to be trial and error. Your emotions are out of whack because of the period, uncertainty and stress, which all reduce progesterone. You can do it...hundreds of women on this site have with great being one of them. I will forewarn though if you have regular, clockwork cycles, progesterone can and probably will throw them off. That is all part of the healing gets worse before it gets better. Again, try the lower amount, non-stop, through your cycle and see how you feel. If you feel worse or there is no change, increase the dosage until you start seeing some results. But look into the other supplements also and try to get them started also because progesterone cannot work alone. Four years it has taken me to find the right combination where I can say with the Lord's grace I hope I am over a huge hurdle. Not to dissuade you with the four years, I saw results probably within the first six months after I found Wray's site, but if I would have listened to Wray from the get-go and did the 500-600mg a day, faithfully, I probably would have seen results much sooner than six months. Have faith that you can reverse all this with the right combination. Don't give up! God Bless! RJ

Feb 05, 2016
ok.. here we go..
by: fiona

Dear RJ,
What a great support, thank you! OK so just one day I bleed like a crazy lady the 6 days normal. So going with the 300 per day. Started few days ago at night, and doing 150 Am and same PM. Putting on my belly and Inside of my arm/wrist and up which today reacted a little, so will move it around. Will let you know if I grow horns and fangs!!

Feb 06, 2016
Wow- this site and Wray are AMAZING. Fibroids (9cmx8) and other. 46..
by: RJ'll be fine. You are fortunate to bleed such as you do at your age. I wish I could have said the same. And if too much progesterone is bad I would be a walking yam I tell everyone! Hang on for changes...oh and put that cream on anywhere. That is a myth of putting it on the thin areas of our skin. If that's the case everyone would be putting it on their lips and vaginal area cause that's the thinnest for us ladies! God Bless! RJ

Don't forget about those supplements too!

Click here to add your own comments

Join in and write your own page! It's easy to do. How? Simply click here to return to Progesterone faq.

Share this page:
Find this page helpful? Please tell others. Here's how...

Would you prefer to share this page with others by linking to it?

  1. Click on the HTML link code below.
  2. Copy and paste it, adding a note of your own, into your blog, a Web page, forums, a blog comment, your Facebook account, or anywhere that someone would find this page valuable.

Search over 8,400 pages on this site...