Confused too much information

by Brenda
(Folsom, CA)

I would really value your input. I'm 51 and do not take any medications, only vitamins and herbs. My health has always been good, but the last several months I'm off. My hair is thinning, fuzzy brain, sweats, poor mood, etc... I started using 100mg last week and increased to 200mg this week after finding your site. I'm feeling very nervous that I'm starting something which will never end and will require the use of more over time. My head hurts most of the day now, which it did not before.
I also added Inositol and nac as your site recommended.
I've stopped reading the comments because the information seems all over the board and I get lost in it all.
I really would like this to be the solution, but one question really nags at me. Your site seems to be about the only internet site recommending such high dosage, if it works like you say, why aren't a lot of other sites recommending the same doses? I would find it hard to believe you are the only health provider who understands this topic. The high dose you recommend means lots of product used which means lots of money spent. I mean no disrespect, but it gives me pause. Everyone agrees progesterone is good, but most are recommending a lot lower dosage. Again, I would like your input, I remain open to exploring this further. I would like to add one more thing, my symptoms have not improved at all, nor have they gotten worse. Thanks.

Comments for Confused too much information

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Nov 15, 2013
How much is too much
by: Kaylana

While I am no expert, I wanted to offer a little input. I've had incredible results from using progesterone cream. You can read about me in these pages.

I, too, was leary of the seemingly push to use more and more cream, but there is one thing that Wray understands - the amount of estrogens, phyto-estrogens, and xeno-estrogens we are exposed to on a daily basis is increasing rapidly. They are in our soaps, skin products, food, water, every where! And then the food we eat only compounds the problem more. I know. I've been there and through it all.

Each woman is unique. Our life experiences are unique. Therefore, our journey to recovery must also be unique. That is why only you can know how you feel and what is happening inside. Wray gives wonderful, science based reasoning for different ailments, but only you can decide how and where to follow that advice. As my newborn, miracle baby sleeps next to me, I'm eternally thankful I followed her instructions!


Nov 19, 2013
Confused too much information
by: Wray

Hi Brenda Having read all of Dr Dalton’s books, medical studies and met her, and learned she only used high amounts. Plus read thousands of studies using high amounts, I not unreasonably concluded that high amounts are needed if symptoms are severe. Many of the women coming to this site are at the end of their tether, low amounts have not helped at all. And have in fact given progesterone a bad name. No one can tell how much is needed until trying it, it’s always trial and error. I can only advise and give studies to support my views. Generally after using a high amount for a few weeks, the amount used can be reduced very slowly. Although there will always be the odd case who needs high amounts for months, to a year or more. Low levels of Vitamin D play a role too, as it will reduce the benefit of progesterone. Please have a test done, and make sure you have enough magnesium and vitamin K2 too. You are now either in Peri-menopause or Menopause with low progesterone and normal oestrogen, it’s this which causes the adverse symptoms. It takes time to redress this imbalance. Take care Wray

Nov 19, 2013
How much is too much
by: Wray

Hi Kaylana Bless you! You’ve brought tears to my eyes, thank you for trusting me. By the way you have set me off on a path of learning. I’ve always been interested in food, and what it does to us. Experimented many times with various foods, diets etc to see how I react. Plus read many studies. Eating the Atkins way, which I tried over 30 years ago, or the Paleo way more recently, seemed so natural, but then I found the Ketogenic Diet. Which has higher fat than the Paleo, lower protein than the Atkins, this made even more sense. So I bought on your recommendation Wheat Belly: Lose the Wheat, Lose the Weight, and Find Your Path Back to Health. Plus Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It, Grain Brain: The Surprising Truth about Wheat, Carbs, and Sugar--Your Brain's Silent Killers. All fascinating. I’ve just downloaded as an ebook Primal Body, Primal Mind, after having listened to the author speak on the Gluten Summit. And ordered the book Gut and Psychology Syndrome by Dr Campbell McBride who also spoke, both so fluent, excellent speakers. Another book I must get, although I don’t intend having a baby! Is the The Better Baby Book, co-authored by another speaker on the Gluten Summit. This is also about having enough good fats, but in this case for the reproductive system. So I have been doing lots of reading, more to come. All of which is good, I was feeling so burnt out answering all queries coming to our site, that I took time off to read them and recover. I’ve decided I can’t answer everyone, so now I’m only going to help Natpro customers, and the odd desperate person. Please keep adding snippets to the site, always so interesting. Take care Wray

Nov 21, 2013
Info galore
by: Kaylana

Hi Wray,
Thanks for your kind words. I can't remember when, but I recommended your site to Dr. Davis maybe almost two years ago. I knew from my own research about the connection between the gut and hormones. Dr. Davis was only beginning to understand just how enormous the field (haha)is that surrounds grain consumption and the disastrous effects on our health. One could spend a lifetime researching just one area. Since then, he has addressed the hormonal connection several times. (By the way, I'm one of the stories in his first cookbook.)

One thing is still a mystery for me. When I first started writing and asking questions on his site and yours there was a research paper from the '30's that talked about the estrogenic effects of numerous grains. The effects were measured by the uterine weight of the test animals. The paper was extremely informative, but within two days of my mentioning it, it was pulled from the internet and is no where to be found! Strange!

Also, no one has been able to tell me why is it that scientists changed their methods for testing the estrogenic effect of an element. No longer is the uterine weight used but blood levels -in male and female rats(which we know are unreliable) and by amounts excreted in urine and feces. The logic is so wrong there. I've seen where various diets are tested on the animals, ex. high fiber, and then excreted hormones were measured. They are over looking the fact that the fiber actually raises the levels inside the body. So any connection between lower or higher levels eliminated really can't be relied upon. (Does this make sense?)

Yes, there is a lot of conflicting evidence out there and it takes time to wade through it all. My advice for everyone who reads this site is that there is no magic cure or magic amount. Only through trial and error can each one make their way back to a healthy life.

I'm glad you got to listen to the summit. I really wanted to, but time is a precious commodity right now. It is wonderful to see all of you (Mark, Dr. Davis, and you) all become connected finally. When I was able to put the dots together over two years ago, it was like a light going off in my head because it made perfect sense.

Thanks again for all your wonderful help. Please take time for yourself first. As my friends remind me - what are the instructions for the air mask in the event the airplane loses pressure? Put your mask on first!

Cheers to a simple healthy life!

Nov 22, 2013
Info galore
by: Wray

Hi Kaylana You are a darling to mention my site to Dr Davis, I wonder if he's taken heed. I don't have his cookbook, but if I get it I'll take a look at your story! The summit was excellent, but as you point out above "grain consumption and the disastrous effects on our health" was only addressed by a few, Dr Davis being one. I know it was a gluten summit, but the affect of the starch side of the grain was overlooked by most. And yet that has even more significance than gluten. I've taken a look for your grains and oestrogen and can find nothing. But I do have a 1946 paper on sheep and clover, see here. This is a 1998 update here. Ironic that they find infertility high, and yet we are recommended to eat phytoestrogens. They are of course in all our foods, even meat. Could ethics be at play in weighing the uterus? It does mean the experimental animal has to be killed. Or anaesthetised, cut open, uterus removed, weighed, then stitched back in, all of which would be too costly. I wish people would realise there is no magic cure, and that it takes time too! I repeat myself endlessly on this, always, always being asked how much should I use! As you said there is no magic amount. Ah yes, the oxygen mask, good one that I'll try and remember! Take care Wray

Mar 07, 2015
by: Suzanne

Did I understand the comment above correctly, that fiber increases hormone levels? Can someone please explain that?

Mar 10, 2015
Fiber confusion
by: Kaylana

Here is a clip from an article I wrote about my own health journey. Hope it helps!

Research from the 1930's showed how grain consumption increased the weight of the cecum inside the digestive tract. It also showed how grain consumption changed the level of estrogen that was excreted from the lab rats. Several years later other research took a different slant to this information saying that the fiber in wheat actually helps to eliminate excess estrogen. But they failed to take into account that the rats being fed a higher wheat diet were also receiving more estrogen input! Increased input resulted in an increase in output - not necessarily an elimination of excess as they stated.

What is important to know is when the indigestible portion of the wheat reaches the cecum in the intestine it frees the estrogen (that the liver has labeled for excretion) back into the blood stream creating a steady increase in the body’s total estrogen.

At the same time, the wheat makes the intestine more permeable allowing larger and larger molecules to be released into the blood stream. Many of these are toxic and can cross the blood-brain barrier thus affecting numerous portions of our brain. The research is mounting connecting wheat/grain consumption to severe mental illnesses from bi-polar, depression, eating disorders, and more.

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