Coming off of Dhea and using progesterone

by Melissa
(North Carolina)

Hey there Wray! Thanks so much for sharing your story... Very inspirational! I pray the Lord blesses you for all the good work you are doing here and in helping others!

I have a question... I was on DHEA 10mg 2-3 times a day for chronic fatigue for 5-6 years. This helped initially but after awhile I didn't notice much energy from the DHEA. I started having these weird fainting sensations so I got my levels checked and my estrogen and testosterone were sky high and my progesterone was very low. I started on your Natpro cream right away and started to feel way worse... weird numbness and spaciness for about 2 months. I have continued on the cream about 1/8 tsp once a day and these symptoms are gone but I still have the fatigue and weight gain.

I gained about 15 pounds since coming off DHEA... I was 135lb and now am 150lb. I eat very healthy and try to exercise but I still can't seem to get the weight off. I suspect I might have low thyroid function even though my tests came back normal... I am taking a natural supplement for that. I know that excess estrogen can cause low thyroid as well.

My question is this... Should I continue on the Natpro cream if my saliva levels come back high even though I am having symptoms?

And what is your opinion about taking DIM to get rid of excess estrogen?

Thanks so much!

Comments for Coming off of Dhea and using progesterone

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Sep 13, 2009
Coming off of Dhea and using progesterone
by: Wray

Hi Melissa. Thanks for the kind words! I'm very relieved you're not on the DHEA any more, it raises androgens, oestrogens and prolactin, it causes cysts and can cause cancer. Please see this paper, and here.

"Also, DHEA may have a dark side. By facilitating internal production of testosterone and estrogen, supplemental DHEA could accelerate the growth of undetected prostate or breast tumors. Studies have shown higher levels of DHEA - and estrogens made from it - in people with breast cancer and endometrial cancer".

And this:

"Therefore, this study suggests that the ovarian cystic condition developed after DHEA treatment in rats, is associated with higher levels of circulating androgens, estradiol, and prolactin."

So it doesn't surprise me your oestrogen and testosterone were sky high and progesterone was very low! Both these hormones, plus prolactin, suppress progesterone. The reason you had those weird symptoms when starting the progesterone was the huge excess oestrogen you have! Please see this web page, it explains why.

The weight gain is due to the excess oestrogen you now have, the progesterone will help balance this, but you need far more than the 1/8th tsp, this is only giving you ±20mg/day. You would need about 200mg/day to reduce the high level oestrogen, testosterone and prolactin you have. It should be used at least twice daily too, to keep levels up. Tests only show how much of any one hormone is circulating, so even if your progesterone is high, it could be the ratio between oestrogen and progesterone is skewed, hence the continuance of symptoms.

Excess oestrogen also causes insulin resistance which could explain your weight gain, please see this web page.

The amino acid tyrosine suppresses prolactin too, it might be an idea to take some, about 1000-2000mg/day. Tyrosine is essential for thyroid function too, you probably have little due to the prolactin levels. DIM is excellent, safe and effective at reducing oestrogen levels, a good idea to take it. Take care, Wray.

Dec 08, 2009
Dhea and progesterone
by: Anonymous

I started with bio-dentical harmones and DHEA. My tests came out sky high too and progesterone low so I cut back on estrogens and then quit the DHEA and and Testosterone. I was growing facial hair and have been losing my hair ever since.

Apr 17, 2010
by: Melissa

Hey there Wray! Sorry I didn't see this post till now! I"m so glad I found it.

Anyways, I'm still taking the progesterone cream but have been having a hard time taking more than 1/4 tsp of it otherwise it causes weird symptoms... even after a year off of the dhea!

I just started taking DIM a few days ago and noticed that I don't look as puffy and my memory has been better. I am concerned though... I have been reading that cruficerious vegetables and soy can cause thyroid suppression. Since Dim has this in there can it cause thyroid suppression?

Apr 21, 2010
by: Wray

Hi Melissa. Well I'm glad it happens to you too, as I miss some I should have answered, and then it's months too late. You have to be the same Melissa I've just answered in another contribution, too coincidental for two Melissa's asking about DIM! Hopefully you will pick that answer up, if not come back to me. I am relieved you're off the DHEA, but you're not using enough progesterone. The symptoms are weird, but unless you increase the amount, it won't benefit you fully. You'll find the progesterone also helps memory, and it's an excellent diuretic. So good in fact that it's now given via IV transfusion to brain trauma victims to prevent the oedema that forms. Please try using 200mg/day progesterone, even more is safe, the higher the better to overcome symptoms quickly. Take care, Wray

Dec 04, 2010
I'm confused
by: Jennifer

I bought DHEA because I heard it will help level out my hormonal levels. I've been using progesterone cream (1/2 tsp a day, day 12-26) for about the last 4 months. The nutritionist I've been getting advice from says since I'm still spotting for a whole week before my period that I should cut back to 1/4 tsp every other day the last two weeks of my cycle. I decided the last month not to use it at all and nothing changed. I still spotted, but only for three days before my period. I bought DHEA at the store today and when I was reading the bottle, it says that it could cause hair to fall out, etc and cause estogen levels to go up. I don't want that to happen because I'm obviously estrogen-dominant and would like to keep the hair I have left at 43 years of age!

So I'm confused... I've read on this site to use 200mg a day to get rid of estrogen dominant symptoms, but that's like 1/4 to 1/2 of the progesterone cream tube. I use Natural Woman at GNC for $30. Is that correct though? That's how much I need to get rid of the spotting/migraine and some clottage?

Dec 09, 2010
I'm confused
by: Wray

Hi Jennifer I'm glad you read the DHEA bottle, so many don't read labels. It can cause more than oestrogen to go up, testosterone too, which is the cause of scalp hair loss, plus cysts and cancer, see here, here and here. Spotting is an indication progesterone levels are dropping, so why you were told to cut back is beyond me. Oestrogen causes the lining to thicken, MMP's are enzymes that break the lining down. Progesterone inhibits MMP's, it's only when progesterone levels drop at the end of the luteal phase that the MMP's can start working and we bleed. If progesterone is low, there's nothing to stop the MMP's from breaking the lining down, hence the spotting. I do recommend 100-200mg/day, and you are right if you are using a low strength cream! It does use the container up very quickly. As you've noticed the low amount you were using was not doing anything, it really does have to be high to have any real affect. Please see our page on How to use progesterone cream. As you're heading for Peri-menopause, please read this page, it gives you an idea of what to expect. Progesterone should only be used from ovulation. Starting on day 12 is fine if your cycle is 25 days long, but if for instance it's 28 days, it should be started on day 15, and used for the next 14 days of the luteal phase. If you should consider increasing the amount, please read this page first on Oestrogen Dominance, this can occur and is disconcerting if it does. Take care Wray

Jan 11, 2011
tsp of cream?
by: Jennifer

2 tsp of cream is equal to 200 mg? Natural Woman progesterone cream has 56 grams/2 oz in a container. Is that right? I'm confusing myself lol

Jan 15, 2011
tsp of cream?
by: Wray

Hi Jennifer Are you sure it's as low as 56g/2 oz and not 560g/2 oz? Even 560g is very low. Assuming it's 560g/2 oz that will give you 9.3mg progesterone per g of cream. If you want to use 100mg/day progesterone, you will have to use just over 2tsp of cream, which is double what you have said. 200mg would require 4tsp of cream. Take care Wray

Feb 07, 2011
tsp of cream?
by: Jennifer

Wray, thank you for all of your advice.

I had went off the cream (using only 40mg a day) to see what would happen and I was still spotting. You told me to use more. I'm late starting it this month, I started on the 18th day and I started spotting again as usual on the 21st day. I usually spot about 5 days before my period. I've been using 200 mg per day since the 18th day. Is it going to take another one or two cycles of using the cream before I stop spotting? Maybe I am not using enough, should I not be spotting at all using 200mg per day?

Feb 24, 2011
tsp of cream?
by: Wray

Hi Jennifer 40mg is far too low to help the spotting. It doesn't even raise the level of progesterone to that of the luteal phase, see here. It will take a few cycles to settle down. Starting on the 18th day is too late, as you didn't have enough time to build up the progesterone level. Please make sure you use the cream from ovulation, and not before. This always occurs, in all women, 12-14 days before they bleed. I don't know your cycle length, so can't advise on when you should start it, but please see our page on How to use progesterone cream for more info. 200mg/day is a good amount, so I'm sure in a few cycles the spotting will have stopped. Let me know how you get on. Take care Wray

Oct 22, 2011
freezing cold hands and feet
by: Erika

Hi, for the last two years i have been dealing with what they "think" is perimenopause. I started getting hot in my stomach, inside of arms and thighs you chould feel it radiating off of me, while my hands, feet and nose remained freezing and also sweating! I have been useing natural Progesterone 100 mg a day the heat went away but my hands got colder however they did quit sweating, now my naturopath has me taking somatotropic plus to help with the cold however i am now extremely hot again and hands and feet are so warm they are red and sweating again needless to say i quit taking the soma two days after i started as i couldnt take the heat, i was wondering if anyone had any suggestions, i did take your progesterone text and scored a 29. Thanks.

Dec 01, 2014
Just give up SUGAR & do coffee enemas 2 restore Ur liver
by: Anonymous

It really bothers me how I see people taking this and that to try and balance their hormones. If most of you just gave up sugar you'd notice a dramatic improvement with how human body will correct itself. As most body as so damaged, I would recommend you also focus on the overload of toxins and unbalanced hormones your liver has trapped in it. Did you know morning sickness is a sign of a poor liver in a pregnant women.

I recommend anyone who real wants to balance their hormones to do those to things to start with. I am not a big girl but the second I gave up sugar the weight just dropped off of me instantly. As I am not eating sugar it is staying off. I still eat my cheese burger but I pass on the soda.

As for the coffee enemas, these release the most powerful antioxidant glutathione which sets to work in your blood stream removing free radicals and correcting alignments that are out of place. To learn more just go and watch the youtube tutorial called "the beautiful truth"

I wish you the best!

Mar 28, 2016
Need Advice
by: Anonymous

I underwent a hysterectomy in Jan last years guess a surgical menopause, I gained 25 lbs in a year and felt miserable. My doc got my tests done my prog was .13, DHEA 134, E2-116.3, I have been asked to take DHEA 10mg a day and progesterone cream 10 mg nightly, I hope I won't have hair loss and hope to lose my weight and my hot flashes and insomnia. Please advice

May 08, 2016
Need Advice
by: Joy

Please read this entire thread and Wray's advice on DHEA, it is not recommended. You have not been advised on how to use progesterone cream correctly. Using the amount suggested is going to put you in a complete spin, it will aggravate your estrogen receptors and you will begin to feel like hell on earth! I am afraid that you you may very well lose some hair because of the incorrect amount suggested also when first using progesterone it can cause it in the the beginning. A number of things can also cause hair loss, please read the page on it. Stress, thyroid, too much vitamin A and hormones not being balanced, can all cause it. Usually 100-200mg per day is needed, more if symptoms are severe. It should be used every day from now on as you are in Menopause.

Weight gain can be caused by excess estrogen and diet. Please reduce the amount of carbs that you are eating, if you have, then make sure that you are eating enough protein and fat. The Ketogenic Diet will help you with this.

Do you know what your Vitamin D3 level is? A deficiency reduces the benefits of progesterone and is connected to every single function cell in our bodies. Please do not forget that Magnesium is needed as an important co-factor. If magnesium, vitamin D3 and progesterone are used correctly it will help with insomnia and all your other adverse symptoms.

Please read the following pages:

How to use Progesterone Cream -
Estrogen Dominance -
Menopause -
Vitamin D3 -
Magnesium -
Ketogenic Diet -
Hair Loss -

Jul 02, 2016
by: Anonymous

I have been prescribed 50mg of DHEA and 25 mg of progestrone cream for low levels.
I started 2 days ago but after reading the reviews I regret taking it...
Can I stop as is only 2 day? Am up the wall worrying what it will do to me and am reluctant to take. Will 2 days make a difference as doc said my levels were abnormally low................
Please advise.

Jul 12, 2016
by: Joy

Hi D

Apologies for only getting back to you now, but you can safely stop taking DHEA after 2 days, not sure if you did this. Good decision coming off DHEA as this thread explains why.

May 08, 2019
Surgical Menopause from Tubal Ligation
by: Kimmy D.

I'm just figuring out now 8 years later that my hormones out of balance, are the cause of all my problems.

I've been screwed up too many times by docs guessing my illness so I've spent the past 10 years symptomatically treating myself.

Just recently I decided to go back to DHEA after having been treated with corticosteroids for bulging discs in my neck. I'm up to 300mg daily of DHEA which was helping with pain and fatigue but I started craving sweets and put on 20 pounds in 3 months! So I prayed to God for help and suddenly remembered I had a box of pre-measured packets of progest cream packets and started using it. I felt relief immediately from pain and fatigue so I thought I could stop the DHEA by weaning off but OH MY just dropping down to 100mg after a week at 200mg and I'm back in pain again.

Although I have dropped 3 pounds and don't crave the sweets, the pain is intense muscular pain all over. Since I had that tubal ligation I'm assuming my Ovaries just quit since my period stopped 2 yrs after the procedure and I was only 42 yrs old then.

My mom and sister went into menopause naturally at age 55 with no real issues so this was all strange to me. So if my ovaries aren't working should I really quit the DHEA or balance the two? Note: I craved the sweets and gained the weight prior to starting the progest. Using both seems to help me but trying to drop down to a lower dose of the DHEA is killing me. Some articles discuss people taking as much as 1600mg per day which is why 300mg was nothing to me. Obviously though I did start small doses a year ago and worked my way up. What say you?

May 10, 2019
Surgical Menopause from Tubal Ligation
by: Joy

Hi Kimmy D

Tubal Ligation can cause problems and I suspect that is where a lot of your problems started.

There is a concern about DHEA. Wray has discussed this in detail further up on this thread. It really is not recommended. Please read all the links that Wray has posted if you have not done so already.

May I suggest that you use a good progesterone cream such as Natpro which is a 3% cream. Between 100-200mg is needed per day. Use half the amount in the morning and the other half at night. I suggest 200mg, you may need to use more to get you over this. Progesterone therapy is not an overnight fix it can take 2-6 months before things improve. Progesterone is also a good anti-inflammatory so it should help with the pain. Please also read the Menopause page.

Vitamin D3 is very important, a deficiency reduces the benefits of progesterone. Nothing less than 5,000iu's per day is needed. Optimal range is between 70-100ng/ml. Magnesium and vitamin K2 with no soy are important co-factors needed when taking vitamin D3.

Oct 01, 2021
Experience with DIM
by: Brenda G

I was reading and advice tried the DIM all I can say is I had a whole bottle thru away cause gave me the worst head aches on my life it said endure them they will stop, no not for me headache stops me in my tracks and I still work and don't need any excess pain, so take at ur own risk is all I got to say. Thanks Brenda G of Jackson TN

Oct 03, 2021
Experience with DIM
by: Joy

Hi Brenda G

I can understand how you feel. DIM was causing your body to detox hence your headaches. Some are affected more than others.

I take it that you were taking it to help reduce estrogen levels? Most people are led to believe DIM reduces estrogen levels, CdG is far better. DIM changes the ratio of bad estrogen to better. Estrogen is broken down into 2 principal metabolites, 2-hydroxyestrone (2-OHE1) and 16-alpha hydroxyestrone (16alpha-OHE1). 16alpha-OHE1 is regarded as a potent estrogen, whereas 2-OHE1 is a weak estrogen. DIM increases levels of 2-OHE1, by doing so it also increases the ratio of 2-OHE1:16alpha-OHE1. This increased ratio is associated with a lower risk for breast cancer see here. Other studies have found a protective role too. Any natural substance which reduces the potency of estrogen is to my mind worth taking. You could try taking Calcium D-glucarate (CdG). This does reduce estrogen and is far better.

Take care.

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