Progesterone causes shortness of breath

by Herman
(Cyprus)

Hi Wray , my name is Herman. my blood tests are low estrogen and high progesterone. Progesterone is at 3, while the reference range is under 1.
After reading your page I decided to try the cream, I did about half of tea spoon of 10% cream. It caused severe shortness of breath. It has been 2 days now, and I just cant breathe. I looked on the internet in the forums , and many many women complain about the same thing while taking progesterone. And they are not taking too little, the dosages like you recommend. I would like to hear your thinking on this.

Also , you constantly talking about increasing progesterone and increasing and increasing. I think the explanation for the need to increase of progesterone is estrogen dominance caused by progesterone and it will get worse and worse. The problem with all of us, not the estrogen , but estrogen mimics which causes copper to be biounavailable. SO your cell is estrogenic since estrogen mimics like mercury tell the cells to act this way . This in turn lowers your estrogen in blood and lowers copper absorbtion , since estrogen mimics act like copper. and progesterone is raised wrongly by the body since it thinks that we have high estrogen and high copper, but we dont have it. Look at all the older people, they are getting grey , since they are copper deficient, and they are copper deficient, since they are full of estrogen mimics. And those people cant take copper, since the cell is estrogenic already, and they cant take progesterone since if they take it like you suggest, that would make the cell progesterone balanced and will cause the body to retain copper and the body will raise estrogen , but estrogen mimics would not go anywhere they will stay in your cell, so you will constantly raise progesterone to balance that new copper that will be coming in on progesterone cream. And then if you quit progesterone , you will be so much worse , it is not even funny.

This is not the way out, the way out is to get rid of estrogen mimics and not copper. Once you get rid of estrogen mimics, estrogen will be raised in blood, and copper will go into the cell.
This is in my case.

Second case is when estrogen is raised in blood. People say , oh you are estrogen dominant. WRONG. If you were estrogen dominant , your body will lower estrogen production, not raise it))). You are copper deficient, or you have progesterone mimics inside, this is what causes estrogen to go up. And progesterone in this case will be like POISON.


Would love to hear, what you have to say about this.

Thanks

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Jul 14, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: RJ

Hello Herman!
I would just like to ask if your theory is correct then how can it be explained that the majority of women begin having problems when they enter peri-menopause, when our bodies are no longer ovulating each month and not producing progesterone. Then also why do we have a huge rise in men who are having breast and prostate cancer. The medical field uses progesterone therapy with men who have been diagnosed with those two type of cancers. Even if we have estrogen mimics we must use something to counter the rise in the estrogen. Whether we are ingesting, breathing or creating estrogen within through fat cells....we must do something to reverse it. Yes, we can stop eating and/or applying estrogen mimics...but we cannot stop breathing and when we reach a certain age and the body stops making progesterone...we all have fat cells that continue to make estrogen and we cannot get rid of all the fat or we would die.
I understand your analogy. Did you start the progesterone only because you had shortness of breath or was it a result of your test results? But I will say my shortness of breath only comes when I have decreased the progesterone. If I stay steady on at least 400 mg a day I do not have this shortness of breath but once I go below that's when it starts to occur. Which tells me that it is the progesterone helping because I have plenty of estrogen due to being overweight and when I do not take it and let estrogen have it's way that's where my problem lies. Maybe Joy can answer for you. God Bless! RJ

Jul 15, 2014
RJ
by: Herman

HI, Rj

I tried progesterone to check out my balance inside of the cell. And I did not have shortness of breath. Progesterone caused shortness of breath. And it does that for many many peoplel since progestgerone increases breathing drive which causes shortness of breath. As far as men having prostate cancer and such, it is all about biounavailable copper, copper protects against fungus, cancer is fungus. When you have high estrogen in blood , they says it causes cancer. LMAO it is trying to retain copper to fight cancer. the goal of the body to be balanced and progesterone is very very dangerous thing to take, same as every other hormone. I balanced many women this year and they got their period s back after not having them for more than a year. Menopause is not natural. NEVER take progesterone or any other hormones, you need to check what your body is trying to do and help it. ALmost in 100% cases, people are low in bioavailbe copper. And you cant take hormones for that, you need to clean yourself out from estrogen mimics, so copper goes in

Jul 15, 2014
BEING overweight
by: Herman

WRONG, estrogen does not make you overweight. Low copper will make you overweight, since you wont use iron properly and would not retain it.WIthout iron your thyroid hormones wont be carried into the cell. Estrogen for the woman makes thyroid go up and not down like many imbeciles will tell you. It is all about balancing minerals, and never touching hormones. Progesterone will make you imbalanced and I dont know anyone who ends up well on it. Look at this forum , look at the side effects all these women are talking about after taking progesterone for a while.

Jul 15, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: RJ

Hello Herman!
I am curious why you would even venture on this site....surely not to cause trouble. Why the insults and name calling. And I did not say estrogen makes you overweight, I said fat cells make estrogen and I have plenty of them because I am overweight....therefore, lots of estrogen. And I have to disagree with you that menopause isn't natural or every female body would not enter it. We all quit ovulating around the same time....not all of us are deficient in copper....so...I believe you would need to take that up with our Creator and ask Him why we enter menopause. Oh and one more thing....most people come on here before they begin progesterone because they are having terrible problems that they never ever had before...case in point me....so the "side effects" you are mentioning are happening to all these people way before they even begin the usage of progesterone. God Bless! RJ

Jul 15, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: Carol K

Hi there. Your point of view is interesting. I would like to see what others have to say but as far as I know, you are Estrogen dominant if the the ratio of Estrogen to Progesterone is not balanced. I am not too sure how to work that out. Wray has mentioned this before. Is it 600:1? I don't want to confuse anyone. Maybe Joy will have a chance to comment.

Jul 16, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: Carol K

I have just read the other posts and when Herman said, "Menopause is not natural" I realised that one cannot deal with someone who thinks like this. RJ - your response makes sense but you may just be wasting your time :).

Jul 16, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: Joy

Hi Herman

I think that you have it slightly wrong. Estrogen mimics do not make one deficient in copper, they actual raise copper levels and lowers zinc! Progesterone of course, does the opposite. I am puzzled that you think Menopause is not natural, what do you base this on? It’s been a natural aging process for women since beginning of time, and it will continue to be. Perhaps the Hormone Testing page will be of some use to you.

The side effects that some women experience when using progesterone are all caused by not using enough progesterone, it is vital that enough is used to overcome these side effects, one of them being weight gain, please read the Oestrogen Dominance page. Many women come onto this site as they are desperate after not finding answers to their symptoms elsewhere. Those who use progesterone correctly benefit greatly, those who don’t suffer side effects. Please read further on Wray’s website, you will find so many women who are truly grateful for what progesterone has done to change their lives.

Jul 16, 2014
RJ
by: Herman

what insults are you talking about. I am just stating the facts. I decided to write here, since I dont agree with Wray and multiple points. And it is not your fat cells that store estrogen, they store estrogen mimics. Your natural estrogen is in the toilet because of that and copper also, No copper you cant use iron and this way you are overweight. I have beeng doing mineral balancing for a long time with sick people and body builders, and Beilive me what is said on this site, is just pure riduculous lie. I posted here, so may be someone will listen. YOu need to be balance, not just cover your symtpoms up with progesterone for a short while, and then deal with real copper overload which progesterone will cause. This is exactly why you contantly need to up the dosage.

Jul 16, 2014
Rj
by: HERMAN

Menopause is probably natural in the sense that it is getting old natural. that is why I stopped and reversed many menopauses this year. Women got their period back when they did not have them for more than a year. So I guess, I dont need to ask the creator, I created it myself))) Sorry to be rude, but this forums knowledge level is a joke. I think I will stay away. But you should study what I told you and one day you will understand what I meant . and good luck RJ.

Jul 17, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: Carol K

Dear Herman. I am interested to know why anyone would want to have menopause reversed and get their periods back, unless they experienced premature menopause and still want to have children. Most women experience menopause in their 50's, like I have and it is a pleasure not having to deal with monthly periods. I understand that most women tend to have fewer hormonal problems pre menopause, but I certainly don't want to be menstruating in my old age.

Jul 17, 2014
Menopause not natural???
by: Alyce

Hi Herman

Menopause not natural? Having periods in one’s old age? I have never heard of anything as ridiculous as that! Sorry to disappoint you, but that is how the female’s body works, it’s how we were made. I have been using progesterone for many years now, and I certainly do not have a ‘copper overload’, it also did not help me for a short while, it actually helps me continually. I had to use a higher dose in the beginning until my estrogen dominance symptoms cleared, and only then did I start to reduce to a level that suited me.

Progesterone works for me and I will continue to use it.

Jul 17, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: Joy

Hi Herman

You seem to be a little mis-informed about various things.

Please read the effects of estrogens and copper – here, here and here. Estrogen actually causes cells to proliferate, including fat cells – see here, here, here, here and here.

Hope this helps you to understand a little more!

Jul 17, 2014
JOY
by: Herman

JOY , read carefully what I wrote. WHen you have estrogen mimics, you dont have estrogen. They are estrogen mimics , they mimic estrogen and your cell acts estrogenic , but at the same time, body lowers your own estrogen production and lowers copper absorbtion. I am biochemist, dont you think I know how mercury or cadmium acts. SO when you cell is estrogenic acting, it lowers your estrogen production and lowers copper. This process is done by mistake, since your body thinks you have high copper but you dont. You have low bound copper. In a while you can have high biounavailable copper, since you develop leaky gut from not having copper for a while and SIBO.

This is why progesterone is helping many here at first, since it lets you bind copper. But cell gets even more estrogenic since copper is going in , that is why you have increase progesterone higher higher and higher. It is dead end .

Good luck, I am not going to write here anymore. Since it is just plain stupid for me to waste my time.

Sorry and good luck

Jul 17, 2014
Carol
by: Herman

Menopause is the imbalance. When you get that , you are getting old big time , since you are imbalanced. That is why you are on this page and thinking about progesterones and stuff like that.

These women who I helped look 5-10 years younger after half a year of their renewed period.

Yeah, you might not care about that , they do .
When you stay imbalance you skin gets old and you look like grandmothers after 2-3 years of menopause. These women are turning back to women from grandmothers. Hey that is what you are trying to do anyway on this forum,. I am just saying you are wrong about the way to do it

Jul 17, 2014
Carol
by: Herman

One more funny thing..You dont want to deal with me. But yet you post under my contribution . it is not like I am responding to you under your article. I just expressed what I experienced and what I know. And I dont ask you to deal with me. I am not dealing with anyone, I am too busy these days. I just wanted to help someone like you , who possesses little knowledge of how the system works.
Progesterone is a cover up , and dangerous one in the long term. I explained why. Chelate estrogen mimics and you will get younger , get your period back and it will last till you are 70. So yes period is not natural, it is the sign that you are old . I guess if you like aging , some people do , then I rest my case


GOOD luck everyone, I wont write here anymore.
Sorry if I ruined your progesterone myth)))

Jul 17, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: RJ

Hello Herman!
Your insult was calling Wray an imbecile. Have you never heard the phrase "you catch more flies with honey than vinegar"? Wray has helped so many women. I do find it ironic that millions of women go through their teens, 20's and 30's with regular cycles and without a glich until the 40's when our bodies quit ovulating and making progesterone....hence all the troubles we begin to encounter. So all women, whether thin or overweight, all, have copper deficient bodies?....I find that unlikely. And aren't you and Wray trying to accomplish the same end result....lessen estrogen. You keep saying get rid of estrogen mimics. Even though they are mimics....it still boils down to it's estrogen. Whether natural and being flushed down the toilet or lathering it on....it's estrogen and it's the estrogen creating the trouble. The medical field stopped the HRT programs due to the high amounts of women getting cancer from estrogen therapy. The TV is advertising Premarin vaginal cream right now and their warning states do not use for any length of time as it will cause breast and uterine cancer and this is an estrogen product. Are some of us deficient in copper? Probably. But tell me I still don't understand if you know it's copper deficiency then why did you even try the progesterone....you must have known where your copper levels were why didn't you just avoid the progesterone altogether. Did you even use the amount recommended by Wray and for at least three to four months? And I have to assume you are a female because Herman, here in the states is a man's name. I will agree with one element to your comments...cancer is a fungus. However, I'm sorry that I cannot agree with you on the rest...progesterone reversed all my troubles...including shortness of breath, which sent me to the ER and that was almost three years ago and I do not consider that short-term usage. And about menopause...I've had many dogs ( I do not spay) and strange how menopause occurs in them also as it does in every female animal that walks this earth. Research history...our tribes of way back have it documented about menopause. The tribes that ate from the land...no estrogen mimics way back then...and yet they all stopped menstruating without copper deficiencies. Perhaps instead of coming onto Wray's site and bashing progesterone you need to create your own site and call it Copper Therapy where all your success stories can be posted just as all of Wray's successes are posted on her site through the use of progesterone. Hello to you both Joy and Carol K. Joy send my best to Wray for me. Always hopeful I'll see a response from her on one of these comments! God Bless! RJ

Jul 20, 2014
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: RJ

Hello Herman!
You are quite confusing. In your last post you say "they are estrogen mimics , they mimic estrogen and your cell acts estrogenic , but at the same time, body lowers your own estrogen production and lowers copper absorbtion." Then further down you state when using progesterone the cell becomes even more estrogenic thus allowing the copper to go into the cell. So exactly what are you saying....you want copper or you do not want copper? I will just say women of hundreds years back did not have estrogen mimics and entered menopause....so I guess you are saying they all were having troubles with copper too? You take a woman who comes on this site and says she has an extremely low progesterone to estrogen ratio. Usually, she is in peri and has all the symptoms that each of us have/had. She is absolutely miserable...some even lose their husbands in divorce over it. But then she takes progesterone and begins to feel better and the ratio improves. But you say it's a copper deficiency. Well maybe it's a D, magnesium, zinc, potassium, iodine, C, E, any of the B's, maybe it's that you have a heavy metal problem i.e. mercury, cadmium, vaccines, aluminum, lead, iron...why choose progesterone as the bad guy. It could be a mixture of so many, but again, to bash progesterone is unfair...you know the progesterone that is made from the soya bean....a natural source, not a man-made source. As for your logic of the need to increase and increase....that increase is used until the symptoms subside and then you bring it down to a dosage that keeps those symptoms gone. If what you are saying is true then nobody would find a cease to their complaints...we all would need to take thousands upon thousands of milligrams a day because the progesterone is increasing or decreasing the copper load and causing our cells to be so maxed with estrogen....as I still do not understand your analogy on the copper load...but the point is most women find the level they need to be at and then they stay there for however long and then slowly decrease...so we all are not on excessive amounts of progesterone for years and years. If it was a copper issue then no matter how much we took or didn't take all our symptoms would still be present because copper is unbalanced and that's just not the case with the success stories on Wray's site. People are not taking copper they are taking progesterone. Then for your comment of staying youthful. That's not why women come on here...they are not looking for the fountain of youth ...they are sick of heavy bleeding, clots, cramps, nausea, headaches, extreme moodiness, painful intercourse, lack of wont for intercourse, sore breasts, water retention, hair loss...their skin wrinkling and showing lines is the last thing on their minds and further, explain your theory of youthfulness to the male race....their skin ages...so you want them to take estrogen too...you cannot get them to resume a menstrual cycle...if you did you'd be a quazillionaire. You know what the sad thing is you come out of the gate bashing and name-calling and a lot of us on this site are very open-minded to new things to improve our bodies and health...otherwise none of us would have found Wray's site in the first place...most of us on here think outside-of-the-box. Had you come on here in a more approachable fashion others may have found your information quite interesting. Then one last thing. Wray backs up her articles with research papers...tons of them. Where are yours? Just because you are a biochemist does not mean your words stand true. If your findings are this remarkable then I would think you would want to have the research documented so others could read and learn and not just go by your words. God Bless! RJ


Jul 21, 2014
RJ
by: Herman

Hey,I thought I mentioned I would not write here. The only one bashing here is you , you are commenting under my contribution and not the opposite. I dont care what studies Wray backs up her stuff from, I dont trust any studies made since most of them are wrong and taken out of the context. If you dont understand what I wrote to you about copper, then I see no reason to further discuss it with you . Body goes by feedback loop system. Taking progesterone automatically increases estrogen and copper absorbtion and lowers your own body progesterone production. So if you take high progesterone you will feel better for a while and it will balance your estrogenic acting cell, but at the same time your copper will be coming in and in a shortwhile , you will need to raise progesterone , since COPPER PLUS ESTROGEN mimics will be greater than ZINC AND PROGESTERONE. ANd then if you by any reason stop progesterone , you will crash since all that copper came in into your body and your own progesterone production stoppped since your are taking progesterone and you crash.

And of course men need estrogen , that is the whole problem with men. They tend to accumulate iron since bioavailable copper is deficient. Same as women do after their menopause.
They dont need to take estrogen , same as women dont need to take estrogen and should not. They should get rid of estrogen mimics with chelating. One way is amber acid or any organic acid such malic acid succinic acid fumaric acid fulvic acid. And this way , it is a cure, not some cover up with progesterone which will end bad.

Dont bother writing to me. I dont like your attitude, I think you mix bashing with posting and the only one bashing is you and especially being ignorant on the subject. And also making some assumptions. I did not call WRAY imbecile, you assumed I did. Assuming is projecting yourself on others. SO peace off

Last post here. SO dont bother posting and expect answers. Stay brainwashed like you are


Aug 13, 2014
curious
by: Jill

After reading this discussion I got curious and went to Google to see what I could find out. It certainly hasn't made me an expert...there's so much to learn. But it was interesting.

On a very quick search, I found out that women experience many symptoms when they are estrogen dominate and have excess copper. Estrogen dominance tends to cause copper toxicity.

Copper toxic women are generally estrogen dominate. It doesn't matter where the estrogen comes from, it still acts as estrogen in the body whether it's a mimic it not. Same with the copper..there are environmental sources of copper as well as food sources.

If a woman is estrogen dominant and lacks or has low progesterone, then her copper levels will rise. In these cases it is recommended that progesterone be used to increase levels. Progesterone actually normalized both copper and zinc levels.

Like I said, I'm no expert, this is just what I found on a quick search.

I also want to clarify a point that was made earlier. No one said that fat cells store estrogen. What was said was that fat cells MAKE estrogen.

As for menopause, of course it's a natural part of a woman's life. It's not a disease. It happens to every woman and is part of a natural process.

For me, I'm well into perimenopause and am looking forward to menopause. I haven't had a cycle for 6 months now and it's wonderful!!! No cramps, clotting, flooding ,anxiety, having to carry and change pads, no worry of leaking....Heaven!

In no way am I saying Herman has no knowledge, but realize that many people here have been helped by progesterone. Some of them for many years now.

Anyways, that's just what I found on a search. I suppose those sites are all wrong too! Lol

Jan 06, 2016
Also severe shortness of breath
by: Anonymous

I am also having severe shortness of breath. I am a 36 yo male. I am taking 100 mg of the progesterone cream per day, based on Wray's reccomended dosages. It is also giving me severe brain fog and dizziness.

I really wish Wray would respond to this one...I have only been taking it for a few days. Should I stop now and give up on this stuff? It is not helping me at all...but if I stick with it will it get better?

Thanks

Jan 17, 2016
Also severe shortness of breath
by: Joy

Hi Anonymous

As the website sates, Wray has retired after 20 years of hard work and helping others.

It is very clear that you are suffering from ESTROGEN DOMINANCE, hence your adverse symptoms Please do a Google search on this website to read all about estrogen dominance. It is not only women who suffer from this, men do too. There are over 100 estrogen mimics in our environment today which affects us all, male and female, young and old. Please read ENVIRONMENTAL TOXINS.

You also have not given progesterone a chance to work, it can take anything from 2-6 months, possibly longer if symptoms are severe. Progesterone therapy is not an overnight fix, time and patience is needed. HOW TO USE PROGESTERONE CREAM will help you to understand what is needed and what to expect. I suggest that you increase the amount of cream used, one often needs to experiment with the amount. The 100mg suggested by Wray is merely a starting point and a guideline.

What is your VITAMIN D3 level? A deficiency reduces the benefits of progesterone.

Hope this helps.

Jan 18, 2016
Progesterone causes shortness of breath
by: RJ

Hello Annon!
I must ask what made you decide to start taking progesterone? Maybe if we know the reason we can advise why you are short of breath. Like Joy said, you have not given it long enough to effectively work. My husband has been on 100mg a day for several months now because I want him to have a preventative dosage for cancer. He did have those troubles in the first week that I was giving it to him and I did tell him he must weather through it that it will balance out. Doesn't phase him in the least now. I will also tell you that shortness of breath can be caused by low testosterone in men. Let us know. God Bless! RJ

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