My History and Some Questions

by Tiffany
(Oregon)

This will be long...
I was diagnosed with adenomyosis, interstitial cystitis, and bowel adhesions in 2004. After many trials of drugs and treatments I ended up having a hysterectomy in 2008 (kept both ovaries). Before the hysterectomy I was told I had estrogen dominance, with low levels of estrogen. I used progesterone cream to deal with it after prometrium failed. After reading on this web site, I know now that I was not using enough cream or using it often enough. The pathology of my hysterectomy showed that I had adenomyosis, proliferative endometrium, and cervicitis. I have now been diagnosed with proctalgia fugax and have to go back for further studies. After my hysterectomy my gyno told me that I should not use progesterone cream because I had no uterus. I once again experienced weight gain a year after my hysterectomy. Depressing. Worse than that was that ALL of my symptoms have come back (minus the uterine/menstrating issues). I know that I am estrogen dominant again. I am not sure if this is true for everyone, but the progesterone cream helped my interstitial cystitis symptoms and I am hoping it helps the bowel issues I am having now. I know they are all intertwined and that I have supersensitive pelvic nerves. I have just started Renaissance progesterone cream and plan to apply three pumps per day/night (that's 96 mg. progesterone daily).

My questions are:

I am 5'1" with a small to medium build. Is the amount of progesterone I need going to be smaller because of my size?

Does progesterone therapy help with chronic pain and nerve pain?

Since I do not bleed, but still cycle (abnormally), I plan to use it daily with no breaks. Is this the best avenue?

I just began therapy this week and my anxiety is worse and I am having horrible headaches. How long will I have side effects?

Comments for My History and Some Questions

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Mar 23, 2011
My experience
by: Eve

While I have not had a hysterectomy, I had severe estrogen dominance symptoms after coming off BCP after 20 continuous years of use. I can tell you that 96 mg would not have been enough to combat the anxiety, suicidal ideation, insomnia, aches and pains I was having. My first thought is to dose according to symptoms - I would increase the dose until you get relief of the symptoms. You can back down later after you have eliminated the severe symptoms. I don't think the amount of progesterone is related to your height/weight but rather the degree of imbalance between estrogen and progesterone. This can be measured by saliva test preferably or blood less preferred. I am unfamiliar with proctalgia fugax. However, I do know that the digestive is very much effected by hormonal imbalance. It's the domino effect...and it takes paying close attention to your body to find the answers. Good luck! Eve

Mar 24, 2011
Progesterone Cream Usage
by: Tiffany

Thank you Eve for your response. I skipped putting on the cream last night because when I put it on yesterday morning I had horrible side effects (hard time breathing, anxiety, headache, bad depressing thoughts, breast tenderness, etc). Pretty much all of the symptoms I normally have but way more intense. Going to work was a chore (I'm a legal secretary) and thankfully my boss didn't have much for me to do and sent me home. I'm also a full time student, mother of a 13 year old daughter and an 18 year old step-daughter, plus we have a small ranch, so stress is a major issue in my life. I am going to increase the dose tonight to three pumps (96 mg) and see what happens. I may not be able to take very much during the day until I can figure this out. From what I am reading and understanding on this web site, I need to increase my dose until I feel better. When will I know to decrease my dose?

Mar 27, 2011
My History and Some Questions
by: Wray

Hi Tiffany Adeno, Endometriosis, Fibroids, IC, see here, are all the result of inflammation. Inflammation is the end result of long term oxidative stress. The stress can be caused by emotional or physical trauma, and nutritional or environmental pollutants. Or a lack of antioxidants, particularly vitamin D. In most cases it is something of everything. Oestrogen is an inflammatory hormone, whereas progesterone is a potent anti-inflammatory. Inhibiting mast cells, see here, suppressing the Th1 inflammatory cytokine response, see here and inhibiting TNF-alpha, see here. There is an increase in mast cell secretions in IC, it therefore doesn't surprise me the progesterone helped, as it suppresses mast cells. The amino acid arginine, another potent antioxidant, also helps, see here. I have no papers saying progesterone will help the proctalgia fugax, but it does help anal fissures and piles, so I would imagine it would. It's certainly worth applying it to the area, internally and externally. Progesterone, and it's metabolite, allopregnanolone, are potent analgesics, so do help pain, see here and here. I recommend 100-200mg/day dependant on symptoms. Size doesn't really have a bearing in an adult, it's the symptoms that concern me. If it's a new born baby, I suggest a mere pinhead amount. Sheer ignorance on the part of your gyno saying you don't need progesterone now you have no uterus. They think it's merely a reproductive hormone, when in fact it plays significant roles throughout the body. I'm running out of space so will open a new comment below. Take care Wray

Mar 27, 2011
My History and Some Questions
by: Wray

Hi again Tiffany Now that you are in surgical Menopause, with no cycle to follow, I do recommend using it daily. But please use sufficient, I don't think you are, as you are now experiencing Oestrogen Dominance. This is always worse if high levels of oestrogen are present. In fact with your symptoms you might need more than 200mg/day. Progesterone does help Anxiety, as do many nutrients listed on the page I've given you. If you are getting headaches, please rub the cream under your ears, all over your neck, face too. Please use the progesterone as and when you feel like it, a minimum of twice a day. Do not use a fixed daily amount, I have some women using it hourly for severe symptoms. Bear in mind stress drops progesterone levels, so more is needed to prevent the return of symptoms. I believe you have a vitamin D deficiency, most of us do. Another potent antioxidant, probably the most potent, it also prevents proliferation of cells, see here. Please have a test done, for more info see the Vitamin D council and GrassrootsHealth websites. This is an excellent video to watch too, see here. Please have a test. The level should be a minimum of 50ng/ml, most labs still use 30ng/ml as a reference point. It's best in fact if the level is between 70-100ng/ml. See these papers here here, here and here. Take care Wray

Mar 27, 2011
My experience
by: Wray

Hi Eve Thanks for this informative reply! I do agree about the amount to use, it really is dependant on symptoms, not on size. I forgot to mention to Tiffany the Saliva Tests we run. From these we've found the ratio of progesterone to oestrogen should be 600:1 and over to feel well. Take care Wray

Mar 27, 2011
My History and Some Questions
by: Tiffany

Thank you Wray for the wealth of knowledge. I am taking vitamin D3 every other day, so I will increase it to daily. I eat pretty healthy, mostly raw fruits and veggies, our naturally raised cow and pig, yogurt, milk, and healthy grains. Diet has helped me tremendously over the years. I do use natural whey protein concentrate daily as it helps with my tendonitis and bursitis. It also makes exercising less of a chore.

I did not go through surgical menopause as I kept my ovaries. I can tell when I am cycling, but not enough to know day 1, day 14, etc. That's why I am curious if I should take any breaks at all. I have no idea how I could up my dose much more with the cream I am using because I am already covering a large area every night. Rotation is getting a bit tricky. I am going to order the cream on this web site from now on since it is more potent (I found this web site after I ordered the cream I have now). Yesterday I used a 32 mg pump during the day and it made me so tired that I slept for 2 hours. How much should I try during the day? Also, at night, should I just rub it on, wait a few minutes for it to kick in, then rub more if I need it? I hope I am understanding this correctly. Oh and is progesterone safe for pets? Our little dog sleeps in bed with us.

Some good news is that I woke up the other day without a headache. This has been the first time in so many years. I also had a wonderful calm energy and was happy, really happy. I am hoping for more days like that, but even one was a small miracle to me. Thank you again.

Apr 07, 2011
My History and Some Questions
by: Wray

Hi Tiffany What a wonderful diet you have, I wish I could do what you do, one day! You are correct about the surgical menopause, I overlooked the fact you still have your ovaries. But having no uterus, and therefore no bleeding, it would be better to use the progesterone daily. Initially progesterone can make us tired, particularly when increasing the amount. But it is good for sleep too, see here. I'm not convinced about having to rotate the areas we apply the cream. I have often given myself a once over, from feet to face, when I feel I need it. You are evidently low in progesterone, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to try that too. But do watch for oestrogen dominance symptoms, they could well occur, but generally pass quickly. I'm so delighted you woke with no headache, I know you will have more days like this. It is remarkably calming too, see here. Do let me know if it helps the proctalgia fugax too. I can then advise others who might have it, although so far only you have mentioned it. As you are finding the progesterone makes you sleepy in the day, I suggest you stick with the 32mg, using the remainder at night. As for pets, we have a number of people who rub it on them! It's very good for epilepsy, a friend had a little dog who suffered from this. She found once she started using the cream on the dog, she could reduce the meds considerably, plus the fits when they occurred were very much shorter. Others have used it for their dogs with arthritis. Vets use it to calm race horses. All vertebrates, of both sexes, make progesterone, even fishes! Take care Wray

Apr 09, 2011
Update about proctalgia fugax and other things
by: Tiffany

Concerning the proctalgia fugax... I have been using the cream for a month now and haven't had an episode (knock on wood). Normally during high-stress I have two episodes per month. I am having high-stress right now because I just started a new quarter of school and only had one week off from the previous quarter. Sometimes it helps with anxiety, but it has definitely helped with my seasonal affective disorder.

I can safely say that my bladder is loving the cream. My bladder spasms are barely painful and feel more like a bird flapping its wings. It doesn't help the urgency, frequency, or burning and stinging on urination, but maybe eventually. I can hope.

It has also helped my chronic constipation, but has yet to help the bowel cramping and sharp pains I am experiencing.

I have been rubbing it on my tendonitis and bursitis and it helps tremendously with that pain. Truly amazing stuff. In fact, I am now rubbing it on my husband every night. He says he hasn't felt this good since his late 20's. It takes his back, knee, and shoulder pain away better than his prescription naproxen. It's also helping his PTSD.

I just started using the Natpro brand and WOW! What a difference this cream is. First, it is smooth and soaks right in, instead of gritty and oily like other creams I've used. Second, it feels stronger and better. An A+ product!



Apr 29, 2011
Update about proctalgia fugax and other things
by: Wray

Hi Tiffany Bless you for the kind words! We have changed the formula over the past 15 years as better raw materials have come on the market. I'm delighted you haven't had another episode of the proctalgia fugax, by all accounts hugely painful. If at any time you have high anxiety, please increase the amount you are using. Stress drops progesterone levels sharply, it's the precursor to cortisol, one of our stress hormones. This of course rises with stress. And please see our page on Anxiety, there's a list of nutrients which all help. I find it unsurprising it's helped your SAD, but I'm delighted it has. SAD is due to a lack of vitamin D, progesterone and vitamin D work together, but a lack of this vitamin reduces the benefits of progesterone. Please increase the amount you are taking, I suggest going to 10,000iu's per day for a month or two. Have you tried taking bicarb and vitamin C for the burning/stinging you experience? I've found this helps greatly. The patent med is a mixture of bicarb and citric acid, but I've found the vitamin C works better. The ratio of bicarb to vitamin C should be 1:2.75, or 10g to 27.5g, this gives a delicious fizzy drink. If there's too much bicarb it tastes awful. I've found 1 tsp 3 times a day works, although it does take a few days to stop the burning. The constipation doesn't surprise me either, oestrogen causes us to retain water, which it takes from the gut. Progesterone is such an excellent diuretic, it's now given via IV transfusion to brain trauma victims, interestingly over 70% are men, see here, here and here. The cramping and pain in your gut is most likely due to low vitamin D, see here and here. So delighted it's helped the tendonitis/bursitis, and helped your husband too. It is a potent analgesic, as I think I mentioned. We have many men using it, these are a few comments you might like to see here, here and here. Please get him to have a vitamin D test done, it really is such an important nutrient. I hope the anxiety page will help him too. Take care Wray

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