Nightmare with pellets

by Sally M.
(Arkansas)

I am 58 years old. I had a hysterectomy at 48, due to fibroids and ademomysis, kept an ovary. I began having menopausal symptoms at about 52. Have a friend who had good results with bio-identical hormones, so I decided to give them a try this year. Do I EVER regret it! One month ago, I allowed the doc to talk me into subcutaneous estrogen and testosterone pellets. She also prescribed oral progesterone, DHEA, vitamin D and other supplements. (These did not arrive until a week after I got the pellets.)

I immedately gained 8 pounds, which is mostly in the breasts and belly. My breasts are extremely sore - feel like they are on fire. I am tired, my migraines (which I've had since I was a child) have increased.

Two weeks ago, the doctor added 20 mg of progesterone cream. When the symptoms got worse, she increased the dose to 40 mg. For one day, I felt like I was on a diuretic and thought relief was finally on the way. Wrong! All of the above symptoms increased with a vengeance, with nausea and dizzy spells added to the mix.

The doctor said the pellets cannot be removed. How long until they are out of my system? Might they cause permanent damage? Any suggestions what to do for relief?

I read your FAQs and the page on estrogen dominance. Very informative but scary!

Thanks.

Comments for
Nightmare with pellets

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Sep 03, 2011
 Nightmare with pellets
by: Wray

Hi Sally I wish doctors were better informed about oestrogen and testosterone. Whether they are bio-identical or synthetic, they still have the same effect on us. It's a great pity they can't be removed, are you sure? It will probably leave a scar, but I think that's a small price to pay. Please see our page on HRT, and these papers here, here, here, here, here here, here, here, here and here on testosterone. It should never be given to a woman, it increases visceral fat, hence your weight gain, plus it increases the incidence of heart disease and cancer. Oestrogen too, plus it causes water retention and inflammation, hence your sore breasts. Progesterone is excellent for sore breasts, see here, here, here, here, here and here. I always suggest rubbing a progesterone cream directly on them. Oral progesterone is the least effective Delivery system as most gets destroyed by the gut and liver. And the amount you were taking is far too low, except to make things worse. I'm running out of space so will start a new comment below. Take care Wray
Sep 03, 2011
 Nightmare with pellets
by: Wray

Hi Sally Progesterone is an excellent diuretic, so your feeling was correct. Amounts over 1200mg/day are given via IV transfusion to brain trauma victims, to prevent the oedema and inflammation that occurs, see here and here. DHEA should never be given to a woman either, as it increases the risk for cysts and cancer, plus increasing testosterone levels, see here, here, here and here. If you do consider increasing the amount of progesterone, please chose a system where it's absorbed well, and do read the page on Oestrogen Dominance again. It can occur when increasing the amount. Progesterone is excellent for migraines, it appears you have always had excess oestrogen, the Fibroids and adenomyosis indicate this, and low progesterone, see here, here, here, here, here and here. The only supplement I can agree about is the vitamin D. The minimum dose should be 5000iu's per day, and the blood level between 70-100ng/ml. Please have a test done, for more info see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth and Birmingham Hospital websites. Take care Wray
Sep 05, 2011
 oral delivery method
by: Anonymous

Hi Wray -- can you please explain the difference between oral administration of progesterone vs. other medications? Why does the progesterone get destroyed in the gut when other meds you take orally do not? Trying to understand!
Sep 05, 2011
 removing pellets, new side-effects
by: Anonymous

Thank you, Wray. I will talk to the doctor tomorrow and press her more about removing the pellet. They're very tiny, implanted in my hip (apparently disappears after you put it there), so she said she is not sure she could find it and that I may have to go through a lot of pain for nothing. I agree that a scar would be a small price to pay if it could be done.

I have never been sorrier about any decision I've ever made in my life. This weekend, my hair began thinning noticeably and that my rosacea (which has been under control for years) flared up. I am afraid to imagine what might happen next. I did increase my progesterone cream to 120 mg on my own. Now my breasts are even bigger and my tummy even puffier. (I may or may not tell her I did this...) I did remember that your site warned that things get better before they get worse.

If you know anyone else who has "survived" pellets, or of there's anyone out there who knows a story, please share. It seems that ever day is a new nasty "surprise" and I'd love to know what I could expect. Surely this cannot last forever.

Sally
Sep 06, 2011
 oral delivery method
by: Wray

Hi there Progesterone is a steroid hormone, these are not manufactured in the gut, but within the body. There's no way of protecting them from destruction, apart from altering the molecule. Hence the advent of progestins or the synthetic forms of progesterone, or the synthetic oestrogens. Most of the destruction occurs in the gut, with the acidity of the stomach and high alkaline pH of the intestines. What little progesterone gets through to the liver is metabolised to allopregnanolone, this is an excellent analgesic. But if progesterone is used via injections, suppositories or creams, far more gets carried to the liver, so the analgesic effect is greater. Take care Wray
Sep 06, 2011
 removing pellets, new side-effects
by: Wray

Hi Sally Strange they disappear, as they are designed to release the hormones on a continual basis. If it can't be done, I can only suggest increasing the progesterone substantially, to counter their negative affects. You'll have to experiment with the amount, some days you'll find you need more, others less. It all depends on your stress levels, as stress drops progesterone sharply. I feel you should try the 200mg/day, but you might need more. For encouragement see these comments on high amounts here, here, here and here. I suggest rubbing the cream on your face, see here. It's also an excellent anti-inflammatory. And don't forget to rub it on your breasts too. I'm so sorry this has happened to you, no one deserves it. Please see this page here on the pellets, it gives a list of the women who've written in about them. I do hope with sufficient progesterone you won't have a difficult time until they dissolve. Take care Wray
Sep 09, 2011
 update
by: Sally M.

I spoke with the doctor earlier this week. She increased my progesterone cream prescription and told me to feel free to use it liberally. She also increased the oral progesterone. I'm using 60 mg in the morning and 60 mg in the evening of the cream. 300 mg oral at night. The nausea I had has improved, but my breasts are still swollen and on fire. I have eaten a little more than usual this week and I know I have gained some more weight. My clothes are even tighter. For the past month or so, my diet was extremely clean. I was afraid to take in too much or junk food for fear of gaining more. Looks like my fears were justified.

The doctor finally said a general surgeon could remove the pellet, but she couldn't do it herself. I know it would take a while to be schedule for surgery and I honestly can't afford the down time from work. I am hoping this will go away soon. She also said if I am miserable enough, she can put me on tamoxifen to block the estrogen. I don't know much about this except that it is given to cancer patients. I am not sure what to do.
Sep 09, 2011
 P.S.
by: Sally M

The doc also ordered another saliva test, should have the results in a couple of weeks.
Sep 16, 2011
 update and PS
by: Wray

Hi Sally I really believe you should be using only the cream, the oral is a waste of time and money. It's doing little to help you, and only putting a strain on the liver. Please increase the amount of cream you are using, I did suggest you try 200mg/day. You might need more, but this will be dependant on symptoms. The reason you've eaten more is oestrogen upsets blood glucose, plus of course it's causing water retention. This can occur immediately on using it, which causes an apparent weight gain, plus making clothes tighter. The testosterone in the pellet is not helping at all either. Whatever you do, don't touch tamoxifen, rather increase the progesterone, as that will suppress the excess oestrogen, see here and here and here and here. The saliva test will probably show you are full of hormones, and that you have sufficient progesterone too. But what most doctors/labs fail to look for is the ratio between progesterone and oestrogen, this is the critical factor. So both your levels could be high, or certainly in the 'normal' range, but the chances are the ratio will be skewed. When the results come back, divide the progesterone result by the oestrogen result, it should be 600:1 and over to feel well. We've realised this from Saliva Tests we run. You might like to read more about saliva tests here. And please have that vitamin D test done, and consider taking it too, it really does make a huge difference to how we feel. Take care Wray
Sep 19, 2011
 update and PS
by: Wray

Hi Sally I really believe you should be using only the cream, the oral is a waste of time and money. It's doing little to help you, and only putting a strain on the liver. Please increase the amount of cream you are using, I did suggest you try 200mg/day. You might need more, but this will be dependant on symptoms. The reason you've eaten more is oestrogen upsets blood glucose, plus of course it's causing water retention. This can occur immediately on using it, which causes an apparent weight gain, plus making clothes tighter. The testosterone in the pellet is not helping at all either. Whatever you do, don't touch tamoxifen, rather increase the progesterone, as that will suppress the excess oestrogen, see here and here and here and here. The saliva test will probably show you are full of hormones, and that you have sufficient progesterone too. But what most doctors/labs fail to look for is the ratio between progesterone and oestrogen, this is the critical factor. So both your levels could be high, or certainly in the 'normal' range, but the chances are the ratio will be skewed. When the results come back, divide the progesterone result by the oestrogen result, it should be 600:1 and over to feel well. We've realised this from Saliva Tests we run. You might like to read more about saliva tests here. And please have that vitamin D test done, and consider taking it too, it really does make a huge difference to how we feel. Take care Wray

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