Confused

by Heidi
(Michigan)

I just have a question, because I am confused about something. I started using NatPro because I feel that I have been estrogen dominant for years. I have always had difficulty with my periods ever since I was a teenager: sore breasts, food cravings, mood swings, fatigue, headaches, anger. I learned about progesterone in my 20's, and I recently started using it because I absolutely could not put up with the horrible PMDD, not just PMS, symptoms I was continuing to have.
What I'm wondering is this. If using the progesterone will ultimately lower my estrogen at some point, will that be bad because doesn't estrogen start declining during peri-menopause/menopause years?? Lowering my estrogen isn't going to ultimately wreak havoc in my body and start causing estrogen deficient symptoms, will it? I know I need to get my hormones tested, and I will, I have just been going by what my body has been telling me for years and assuming I am estrogen dominant.
Now I am freaking out because I'm afraid I am going to lower my estrogen too much and become progesterone dominant, and I don't know if that's a bad thing or not. Can too much progesterone and too little estrogen be harmful?? I just really want to feel better, and I have read that too much progesterone can actually cause symptoms like estrogen dominance (sore breasts, fatigue, mood swings, acne, hot flashes, headaches, etc.). Wray, could you please shed some light onto these questions I have?? Thanks.

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Dec 21, 2011
Confused
by: Wray

Hi Heidi It is confusing, as there is so much misinformation about progesterone. It's essential to make it the dominant hormone. All those symptoms you say you've had over the years, point to low progesterone. It appears you were either not ovulating, or more likely your corpus luteum was making insufficient progesterone, leading to a defective luteal phase, see here, here, here, here, here, here and here. Trust what your body tells you, it's right! In fact if you look at the list of so called progesterone dominant symptoms they are the same as the oestrogen dominance symptoms. Now why would this be?! I'll tell you, most people are advised to use far too low an amount of progesterone, ie 20mg/day. This is enough to stimulate oestrogen and continue stimulating it unless the amount of progesterone is raised to 100-200mg/day or more, as it's dependant on symptoms. We have more info about this on our Oestrogen Dominance page. If you have your hormone levels tested, you will probably be told they are in the normal range. But if oestrogen is high normal and progesterone low normal, all hell can break loose. You have to look at the ratio of the two hormones. We've found from Saliva Tests we run that the ratio should be 600:1 and over to feel well. It's very difficult to get oestrogen deficient symptoms, as not only do the ovaries make it each month, but so do our fat cells. And once in Menopause the fat cells become our main source. Apart from which, there are now over 100 oestrogen mimics in our food, air, water and the skin care we use, especially sunscreens. Continued below.

Dec 21, 2011
Confused Part 2
by: Wray

Hi Heidi You might like to see these comments from other women with bad symptoms and the amount of progesterone they use, see here, here, here, here, here, here and here. We also have more info on our page How to use progesterone cream. Take care Wray

Dec 22, 2011
Thank You!
by: Heidi

Thank you so much for responding to my post, Wray. I do believe 100% that I have been estrogen dominant since I was a teenager, and I recently purchased your progesterone cream, and I could already see a difference in my symptoms just from using the first tube. My PMDD was not nearly as bad this month, which was a relief. I did experience SOME breast tenderness, but it wasn't nearly as bad and it didn't last as long as usual. I actually wasn't sure how much to use at first, so I started out using 2 full tsps. per day, 1 tsp. in the morning and 1 tsp. at night. I thought it seemed like a little much, so I checked your website again, and I found that using 1/2 tsp 2x a day would give me 166.5mg progesterone. That's within the 100-200mg you recommend, so I stuck with that until my period started. I actually had to open a second tube to get through this cycle because I used so much in the beginning, but that's OK. I should get about 2 months of usage out of the 3 that I ordered, and that should be sufficient to get things going. I'll just have to order more a little sooner than planned. I just want to say that I really love your cream, Wray. I have used other creams in the past, but none have worked as well as NatPro. It's unbelievable how well it absorbs! I don't have to rub and rub to get it to soak in. I'm hoping that my symptoms will continue to lessen and I will start to feel normal for the first time in my life as I continue to use the cream. Thanks again, Wray!

Dec 22, 2011
Thank You!
by: Wray

Hi Heidi Actually I'm delighted you weren't sure how much to use and used the two tsp. This gave you about 330mg/day progesterone, an excellent amount. I've been trying to encourage people to use more, but err on the side of caution by suggesting 100-200mg/day. It's hard enough to get people to use this amount, when everyone else says use 20mg/day! I've found the higher the initially amount, the less Oestrogen Dominance they get. In fact women starting on 400mg/day have found they don't get any. Although here again, some could if they have a great deal of excess oestrogen, and bad symptoms because of it. But they will be mild in comparison to that experienced with low amounts. I still use about 170mg/day, which means I go through about 2.5 tubes a month. As you've reduced the amount, please be aware of any adverse symptoms, they could occur. Particularly the few days before your period, please increase the amount if you should get any. Also rub the cream on your breasts, I find it works quicker if applied directly on the area which is sore, see here, here, here, here, here and here. Sore breasts can be caused by lack of iodine, see here, here, here, here, here and here. An easy way to find out if the level is low is to get a tincture of iodine. Put 3 drops anywhere on the inner arm, rubbing them in with the dropper. If the patch fades in a few hours it means there's a deficiency. Continue applying it until the patch takes days to fade. Alternatively have a blood test. Continued below.

Dec 22, 2011
Thank You! Part 2
by: Wray

Hi Heidi Progesterone also helps migraines and headaches, see here, here, here, here, here and here. Bless you for saying that about the cream! We've been making it for 15 years now, and have re-formulated it a few times too, as new natural raw materials come on the market. Ultimately I would love it to be organic. I've tried others too to get a comparison. I think using it myself helps, I couldn't bear to spend time endlessly having to rub it in! You might like to see our page on Insulin Resistance, this is often behind fatigue and cravings. Take care Wray

Dec 24, 2011
Question
by: Heidi

Sorry to bother you again, Wray, but I have a question about something. Do you know if hair loss due to hormonal imbalance can be stopped or reversed?? I will quickly explain my situation to you. I am experiencing hair loss. I am 32, and I am not quite sure what is causing my hair loss. I first noticed the major shedding around August 2011(about 4 months ago). Prior to August I had gone through some major emotional stress. I don't mean just normal, everyday stresses, but true, serious stress. I lost some weight due to the stress, and my body felt like it was going haywire. Prior to the major stress, I had been OK. Yes, I had been experiencing estrogen dominant symptoms, but nothing out of the norm that I wasn't used to (not hair loss). Anyway, a couple of months after the extreme stress, my hair started shedding like crazy. I did some research, and I know that after an extremely stressful event a person CAN experience something called telogen effluvium (you should look it up if you don't know what it is, it's a lot to explain). Anyway, four months later, I am still experiencing extreme hair loss. I am going to go to the doctor to try and find out what is going on, because I don't know if the hair loss is due to the TE, or if the stress caused a shift in my hormones and is causing me to lose my hair. I am scared because some of the new growth I see coming in is fine and weak and pulls out easily, a sign that the hair follicle is miniaturizing from hormonal imbalance. I understand thyroid problems can also cause hair loss. Maybe my thyroid gland got bothered by all the stress. I have an appointment coming up to discuss these matters. Most of my hair loss symptoms point to TE, but because some of the new growth isn't healthy, I am wondering if it's not TE and it's really my hormones. I know women can experience hair loss, but I thought that happened mostly during menopause. My main question is if I find out it's due to hormonal imbalance, do you think progesterone will help stop the hair loss?? Does progesterone help with androgen/testosterone sensitivity?? I feel that I am way too young to be losing my hair, and I'm really scared. It's very frightening to see all of your lovely, thick strands going down the drain and falling on the floor every day. I have become obsessed with it, and it's causing me even more stress. I was doing OK for a little while because I had thought the hair loss was due to TE and would start to clear up within 6 months to a year, but when I noticed some of the new growth isn't coming in healthy, it started a whole new round of stress because I fear that I am going bald because of too many androgens/DHT affecting my scalp. Do you think using the progesterone will balance these hormones out if I find out it is, in fact, hormones causing my hair loss. I really don't want to lose all of my hair. :(

Dec 25, 2011
Question
by: Wray

Hi Heidi Stress plays havoc with us, it upsets everything. Hormone levels drop, neurotransmitters too, the gut slows down so less nutrients are being digested, when in fact more than ever are needed. Blood vessels constrict, often the heart beats faster than normal. So yes your hair loss is undoubtedly caused by the stress. And being stressed about the loss is not helping either. One study I've read acknowledges that the skin, endocrine, nervous and immune systems cannot be treated individually, but must now be considered together. I see I haven't asked you to have a vitamin D test done, please do it soon. Living in Michigan you won't be getting enough sun, certainly in winter. Vitamin D is needed by every cell to function normally, a lack leading to many of our current diseases and disorders. Stress drops vitamin D levels sharply, as it does progesterone. It's vital for the angen phase of hair growth, see here, here, here, here, here, here, here, here and here. For more info on levels, testing etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth, Birmingham Hospital and Vitamin D Links websites. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml or 175-250nmol/L and not the 30ng/ml or 75nmol/L most labs and doctors regard as adequate. And the minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although the latest research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here.
Please consider taking these nutrients…
Vitamin D 5000iu's/day as a minimum
Inositol 2000-4000mg/day This is known as the anti-alopecia vitamin
NAC 1000-2000mg/day N-acetyl cysteine
Biotin 2-3mg
Thiamine 100mg/day vitamin B1

All these are known to help with hair loss. Take care Wray

Dec 25, 2011
More questions
by: Heidi

Thank you, Wray, for telling me about Vitamin D. I am wondering if there is a particular brand/kind you suggest taking that doesn't cost a fortune? Also, I thank you for telling me about the other supplements that are good for hair loss. At this point, I am taking a vitamin/whole food supplement powder that I make into a shake each day. It contains many vitamins, minerals, fruits, vegetables, amino acids, green foods, myco defense mushroom blend, digestive enzymes, and an omega fatty acid seed blend. I add 1 TBSP of brewer's yeast, 5000 mg of vitamin C powder, and 1 TBSP of flax seed oil to the shake before I blend it all up. Oh, the shake is made from PEA protein, not soy. I did recently purchase some inositol, but per your recommendations, I will up the dosage I am taking of that. Of course, I am going to continue using my NatPro cream each month. I do need to add in a couple of things you suggested, especially the vitamin D. One more thing, I am also taking a magnesium citrate powder. I always use 1 tsp. per day, sometimes 2. I mix it with hot water and drink it each night (some mornings, too). I do what I can afford to do to try and help myself. I have always been prone to stress and anxiety, and it has definitely gotten worse as I've gotten older. I am trying to give my body what it needs, especially since I had such traumatic stress about 6 months ago. I really am trying to control my stress, and I think if it weren't for my hair loss, things would be a bit better for me. It's like I can't stop thinking/worrying about it, and it really makes me feel all out of whack. Worrying and obsessing about that ONE thing is keeping me from feeling healthy, I think. Any suggestions as to what to do?? Should I just accept it for what it is and go day by day with it? I think it will get better if I just stop stressing about it. Do you think it is hormonal at all? I know it's hard for you to answer this, and the only thing I know for sure is that I wasn't losing my hair BEFORE my stressful event came about, honestly. Do you really think the stress caused the onset of the hair loss? Should I have my thyroid checked? Anyway, sorry to bother you with all of this. I just got some gift certificates to my local health food store for Christmas, and I am going to use them to purchase the vitamin D and some other supplements you suggested. Thanks for your time, Wray.

Dec 26, 2011
More questions
by: Wray

Hi Heidi Yes there is a brand. Please go on the vitamin D Council's website, see here. Scroll down the right hand menu and you'll see they offer test kits, plus two supplements. Both brands have a 5000iu, one has a 50,000iu, this brings levels up very fast if too low. Please have a test done, as there's no way of telling if your level is too low, besides doing this. Many of your symptoms point to it. We should all have tests done every 6 months, as levels fluctuate with the seasons and with stress. For instance one paper I read told of a woman involved in a car crash. Her level had been in the 90ng/ml range, but after the crash it had dropped into the 30ng/ml range. Any stress, be it emotional, mental or physical, will have the same effect. Magnesium is excellent as it's the most important co-factor for vitamin D, plus it's very calming. Your shake sounds very good, but please check it doesn't contain any artificial sweeteners, they often do. Or too much sugar or glucose. Incidentally all legumes contain phytoestrogens. Please read through Dr Wilson's website, as undoubtedly your adrenals are stressed, see here. He gives advice on how to help them. It would be better if you stopped stressing about your hair loss, it happens so frequently after stress, including childbirth. This last interests me, as pregnant women have beautiful hair. Progesterone will play a big part in this as levels rise greatly while pregnant. And yet after birth progesterone drops precipitously, sending many women into PND. It seems plausible that it's the drop in progesterone which caused the hair loss. Try meditating, or listening to soothing music, or soaking in a bath with two handfuls of magnesium sulphate (Epson Salts). And please look through our page on Anxiety, it gives a list of nutrients which help, taurine and glycine are particularly calming. So yes, I do believe the hair loss was caused by the stress, and yes I do believe hormones play a part in it, particularly progesterone and vitamin D. But so do all the nutrients we need, without the healing amino acids, hair will not flourish, nor will nails. Your hair will only become healthy again after you stop worrying about it, this is just adding to the stress. I don't think you need check your thyroid, much better if you check your vitamin D level, as if low it also impact adversely on the thyroid. Take care Wray


Dec 26, 2011
Ingredients in shake
by: Heidi

I just want to run this by you real quick. The shake I am taking contains 100% pure crystalline fructose, natural flavors, chicory root extract, maltodextrin fiber, xanthan gum. Those are the "other ingredients" listed at the bottom of the container. The green foods it contains are spirulina, kelp, alfalfa, barley grass, dandelion, wheat grass, melissa leaf, lemon grass, nettle, blessed thistle, chlorella, plantain, blue green algae, cilantro. The veggies it contains are parsley, kale, spinach , wheat grass, brussels sprouts, asparagus, broccoli, cauliflower, beet, carrot, cabbage, and garlic. I didn't think about the fact that some of these might be phytoestrogens. Do you think I should stop taking this shake as my multivitamin/whole food supplement and take something else?? Do you have a suggestion of a good multi that I can take? This shake is called Alive! Whole Food Energizer by Nature's Way. Any thoughts??

Dec 26, 2011
Question
by: Heidi

Hi, Wray. I was just wondering why you recommend using so much more progesterone each month than others do? Also, if it is normal for the body to only produce 20-40 mg per day during normal production in the month, why do you recommend it is necessary to use so much more? I am only asking this out of curiosity, I hope I don't sound rude. I know you mentioned somewhere about a low dosage keeping the body in stimulation mode, what does that mean? One other thing. What do you think about the Emerita brand of pro-gest? It says that it is bioidentical and the only one backed by clinical studies. Any thoughts on this? Thanks!!

Dec 29, 2011
Comments
by: Heidi

Hi, Wray. I received notification that there was a response to some of my comments on here, but when I checked for the responses, nothing showed up. I wonder what's going on?? I was really hoping to get your insight about the vitamin shake I am taking. I'm guessing you probably did respond to my inquiries, but for some reason, they didn't show. Maybe something happened, and I will continue to look for a response. Thanks!! :)

Jan 02, 2012
Ingredients in shake
by: Wray

Hi Heidi The green foods are good, but you mentioned pea flour in your previous post, that's why I cautioned about the phytoestrogens. Fructose is not a good sugar, it decreases SHBG (sex hormone binding globulin) by 80%, this allows free testosterone to rise, see here. Although progesterone raises SHBG, and therefore lowers testosterone, see here, it merely means there's more work for it. I would finish it up and find another green food, I don't know of a particular brand to recommend. I don't think you're being rude, but if you look back at my first reply to you, you'll see I tell you why I recommend more progesterone than others. Progesterone and oestrogen stimulate each other. So when first using progesterone it stimulates oestrogen, hence the Oestrogen Dominance symptoms occur or increase. This page goes into more detail. And yes it is normal for a woman to produce between 5-40mg/day progesterone during the luteal phase. But if this was sufficient, none of us would get the adverse symptoms we do! Many things drop progesterone levels, or raise oestrogen. For one thing from about age 35 we begin getting anovulatory cycles, when no progesterone is made. So oestrogen rises. Stress drops progesterone levels, so oestrogen rises, a lack of vitamin D reduces it's benefits, have you had a test done yet? Phytoestrogens, although much weaker than oestrogen, still have an oestrogenic affect. Large meals and dark, winter days reduce levels of progesterone and more. Pro-Gest is good, although phenoxyethanol has been banned by Ecocert for use in natural and organic skin care since June 2008. It has half the amount of progesterone Natpro contains. This is the study you're referring to, see here. Many other studies have been done on progesterone creams, they all report success, see here, here, here, here, here, here and here. Continued below.

Jan 02, 2012
Ingredients in shake
by: Wray

Hi Heidi The first paper in fact studied the transdermal route for many drugs, all were absorbed well. We know Natpro is, as a naturopath in the UK runs Saliva Tests for us. She does a before and after test, and you'll notice how high the progesterone rises. More to the point the women felt well. Take care Wray

Jan 02, 2012
Comments
by: Wray

Hi Heidi I have answered them all, and on this page too. Please check again. Take care Wray

Jan 02, 2012
Thanks
by: Heidi

Thanks for responding to me, Wray. I finally got your comments. :) I actually do not plan to finish the shake I have been taking. After you mentioned phytoestrogens, I decided to find a different multi (in a pill form) to take. I hope I haven't done too much damage by taking the shake. I actually only took it for about 2 months or so, possibly less because one can only lasts about 2 weeks, and I was just starting my second can when I asked you about it. And I do understand why you recommend more progesterone, especially after reading your last response. I only asked about the Emerita Pro-Gest because that is what I first started using back in July until I found your site and your cream. As soon as I found your site and compared the ingredients of NatPro to the questionable ingredients in the Emerita brand, I got a little worried and immediately switched. Sorry to sound doubtful of things, I just get myself worried sometimes. If I could just get my hair loss under control, I would be a happy woman! :)

Jan 04, 2012
Thanks
by: Wray

Hi Heidi You won't have done any 'damage' by taking the shake, and in fact could finish it, seems a pity to waste it. It's just that I caution against ingesting too many phytoestrogens, they are unavoidable unfortunately. Grains and legumes having the highest amounts. Please don't worry about the hair loss, it will grow back! Just give it time. Take care Wray

Jan 06, 2012
One other question
by: Heidi

Sorry to bother you again, Wray, but I have another question for you. I read that progesterone in high amounts can actually cause androgenic affects in the body, that it stimulates the adrenals to produce more androgens. Is this true, and if so, do you know how high of an amount of progesterone would do this?? I don't think I'm getting too much by using the 1/2 teaspoon (almost 167 mg according to your info), but I get scared sometimes when I read things. Can you give me any reassurance on this?? I know I sound like a nut case, but I just get confused at time. Thanks! :)

Jan 06, 2012
Question
by: Heidi

Another thing I am wondering is how many cycles or months can the estrogen dominance symptoms last once you start the progesterone (if one experiences them at all)? Should it be something one can possibly experience with the first tube (month) only, or can it take a few tubes (months) to get through the symptoms?? It's just something I need clarification on. Thanks! Also, I think in my last post I mentioned that I use the 1/2 teaspoon and get almost 167 mg, but I meant that I do the 1/2 teaspoon twice a day to get that amount.

Jan 07, 2012
One other question
by: Wray

Hi Heidi I have yet to hear of high progesterone stimulating the production of the androgens. If in high enough amounts, such as I suggest, it suppresses the androgens and oestrogen. It does this by decreasing sex hormone binding globulin. A low level of SHBG binds more testosterone, oestrogen to a lesser extent. It's the free testosterone in women that causes problems such as an oily skin, acne, facial hair and scalp hair loss, see here. In fact it causes this in men too. I can't tell you how long oestrogen dominance will last, although I have found amounts in excess of 400mg/day has prevented it in many women. But unfortunately others need higher amounts. Some women respond quickly, others take months. It depends on how much oestrogen is in the system. Thanks for the clarification! Take care Wray

Jan 07, 2012
Response
by: Heidi

So, does progesterone help regulate the free testosterone? Is there anything else that does or should progesterone take care of the testosterone. I think I should just quit looking things up and worrying about them so much. I think I should just trust that I have been estrogen dominant (according to my body signals), and trust that the progesterone will help me. I get to looking so many things up that I scare myself and cause worry. I think the thing that still has me caught up is the dosage of the progesterone cream. I explained to you what I am using, and I think that should be enough. I think I will be a better judge of that after this next cycle I'm due for and the one after that. At that point, I will have been on the NatPro for almost 3 months, and I should know by then if I'm getting what I need. I say ALMOST 3 months because when I first started out, I was using 2 full teaspoons a day because I wasn't sure how much to use. I lowered my dosage about 1/2 way through that first cycle, so my first tube didn't last a full month (I had to start the 2nd one sooner). I'm sorry to constantly bother you, Wray. It's just that I have never had anyone who really knows anything to talk to, and like I said, I look up too many things and get myself worried. Not good. I just want to make sure I am doing the right thing, and that I'm not messing up my system. I know hormones are very delicate, and I don't want to hurt myself or cause any worse problems for myself. Does that make sense?? If you have any other advice for me, I'll gladly take it.

Jan 07, 2012
Ugh
by: Heidi

I have to be honest, Wray, I am a mess. I am a confused mess. I am struggling to maintain most days, and it seems that everything has been worse for me since I started using the progesterone. I am really scared that I have messed with my hormones too much and that I will never feel balanced or be balanced again. I have always struggled with anxiety, but it seems to be so much worse since I started using the progesterone. I know I have been estrogen dominant since I was a teenager, I have had so many symptoms. I started using the progesterone back in July because I was tired of the menstrual migraines, severe fatigue, and mood swings every month. I started out using the Emerita brand of progesterone at 40 mg per day, total. I didn't really feel any difference with that, so I thought maybe I wasn't getting enough, and after the first month I started using 80 mg per day, total. I'm pretty sure I started using it on an incorrect schedule until I started figuring things out better. I have really only had one screwy period since I have been on the cream, and that was after I upped the dosage to 80 mg per day. When I did that, I started my period early by about two weeks. I don't remember the exact month I started using the NatPro, maybe September or October. As I have said before, I started out using a high dosage of the NatPro because I wasn't exactly sure how much I was supposed to use until I explored your site further. Anyway, I just don't like the way I feel. I don't know if it has anything to with the progesterone or not, but I feel like I'm going crazy!!!! What can I do?? I believe that I am on a 28 day cycle, so I have been using the cream starting on day 14. I have no idea if I need more or less or what. I'm really starting to get scared, Wray. I know I need a saliva test, but I can't afford one right now, haven't been able to afford one or I definitely would have gotten one a long time ago. It's enough to purchase the progesterone. I'm just really confused about what's going on with my body. I felt better when I wasn't on the progesterone and had to deal with the expected PMS issues. Would it be harmful to just stop the progesterone?? What would that do to me? Maybe I should use a higher dosage until my one last tube is gone and see if I feel better. Maybe I just need more. It is now January 7, and I am due to start my period around the 21st or so. I started my last period on December 21st, and I began using the NatPro again on January 3. I counted the 21st as day one, right?? I have only been using the 1/2 tsp 2x per day, and I actually feel a little breast tenderness already, and my mood is crazy. Do you think it's estrogen dominance symptoms?? Do I need more cream?? PLEASE help me the best you can, Wray. I need some advice and guidelines. If I stop the cream for a while and try to start fresh, what will that do?? Will it make my hair fall out worse??? I just can't seem to get this thing right. Any input would be helpful.

Jan 08, 2012
Decision
by: Heidi

Hi, Wray. I have decided to stop using the progesterone for a while. I hope this isn't a bad idea. I feel like I need to start fresh with this whole thing. I am going to be getting my tax money back in February, and I will be able to afford a saliva test. I just don't know what I'm doing with the cream, and I want to feel better. I really hope I don't experience too many adverse side effects from stopping the cream. Can you tell me some things I could expect from doing this?? I want to start it again, but I need to be able to do it a better way by actually finding out where my levels are at. How long should I discontinue the cream before I get the testing done? Does it take a long time to rid it from the system? I just can't take the mental confusion I am feeling on a daily basis. I don't even know what's causing it, but if it's my hormones being out of whack, I think I should just stop the progesterone for a while to see what happens. I am worried that it will cause my hair loss to worsen because I think that's why some women experience hair loss after pregnancy, but hopefully it won't last long. I'm not sure if I should just stop using it now, or at least finish out this cycle with it and then stop. I should be due to start my period on or around the 21st of January, so maybe I should continue using it the next couple of weeks and then stop. What do you think?? Can you please help me with this decision? Truly desperate. Thanks.

Jan 09, 2012
Can't see response
by: Heidi

Hi, Wray. My e-mail is saying that I have responses to my last couple of posts, but nothing is showing. I am desperate for answers, so I will keep looking for your response. Thanks, Wray. :(

Jan 09, 2012
Confused
by: Joy (South Africa)

Hi Heidi - I have read this entire thread and you seem to be asking Wray the same questions over and over of which she has responded to. You appear to be an extremely stressful person which is most definitely causing your hair loss, that and low progesterone levels. Vitamin D is important too as it is connected to every single cell in our bodies. It also helps to absorb progesterone and vice versa so to my mind they work hand in hand and should be used/taken together.

It is such a pity that you have stopped using Natpro but I think by you visiting various websites and blogs you have become misinformed and very confused. Anything between 100mg to 400mg possibly more depending on symptoms of cream should be used daily, anything less and you simply aggravate your estrogen symptoms. The higher the dose the quicker things will settle down. Progesterone HAS to become the dominant hormone before things fall into place. Another important thing to remember is that it can take anything from 1 to 6 months for things to settle down, this all depends on how estrogen dominant you actually are, the more estrogen you have the longer it will take. So you really have not given the cream or your body a chance to adjust.

Please follow Wray’s advice and visit the links that she has provided, they will explain so much more to you! I hope that this has helped you a little.

Jan 12, 2012
Response
by: Wray

Hi Heidi I've been travelling and had no internet access. The emails will be advising you of any new comment, including your own, of which there were three. Then one from Joy. If you read that paper I gave you, it shows progesterone suppresses testosterone. As Joy says why worry yourself by looking at blogs, read the studies done on progesterone, that's all you need to do. Progesterone has been used safely for over 60 years now, with no adverse symptoms reported. It's only when people use too little for their own symptoms, that things go awry. Dropping the progesterone as you did so suddenly will have caused more problems. It should be lowered by no more than 16mg/day. I use about 1 tube every 10 days, so if you have to use a lot to begin with, the tube will not last a month. The anxiety is only worse because you change the amount you're using. Please see our page on Anxiety. It gives a list of nutrients which all help, consider taking some of them. I also suggested you used the cream daily, through your period too, to ensure suppression of the oestrogen, then and only then should you consider reducing the amount. The saliva test will only tell you how much of any one hormone is circulating, it won't tell you about the symptoms you're experiencing. Symptoms should always be used as a guide. Stopping the progesterone will cause the symptoms you had been experiencing to come back again. And, as Joy says, please have a vitamin D test done, and begin taking it when you know your level. Let me know how you get on stopping the progesterone. Take care Wray

Dec 01, 2012
Hormonal Imbalance
by: Anonymous

Hello Wray,

I have been reading your posts here. I began taking progesterone cream about five months, 1/4 tsp twice a day, and at first I felt better from the horrible pms and hormonal issues I was having like irritability, anger, foggy brain, insomnia, changes in cycle, depression. Then everything started to change when I started getting bad symptoms when my period came and I stopped the progesterone cream, I would have really bad pms. So I asked the company for advice and they said to stay on the cream through my period at reg. strength, 1/4 tsp. twice a day, then take less 1/8 tsp. until my 12 day and resume the 1/4 tsp. again. I tried this and it helped a little for a month or so, now I am getting sypmtoms again. Also I have been having some episodes of low blood sugar that really cause me concern as it has affected my thinking and even slurred speech. I wasnt sure what was happening, but I felt so strange so I checked my blood sugar with my diabetic daughters tester and it was low both times. I ate something and felt better. Anyway, i am so confused about what to do and how much to take and I just need to feel better. I have six children, ages 3 to 16, and two children with special needs, I am under a lot of stress, and actually had a life changing event about a year and half ago that sent me into a depression for a year when my six year old was diagnosed with Juvenile Diabetes. I didn't know how badly stress can deplete progesterone and raise cortisol levels. I am 46 years old and I think I am peri-menopausal. Please help me and direct me where to go. I do not take any vitamins at the moment but I am looking for a good one to take.


Dec 02, 2012
Hormonal Imbalance
by: Wray

Hi there This happens all too frequently, the 1/4tsp is probably giving you about 20mg/day, so at the most you're getting 40mg/day if you do this twice. This doesn't raise levels to that found in the luteal phase, see Progesterone Misconceptions. It doesn't surprise me you initially felt better, then went downhill. Progesterone can help all those symptoms, but the amount has to be far higher. The initial burst of progesterone helps, but then it begins to stimulate oestrogen, hence your symptoms. The amount has to be at least 100-200mg/day, in your case I would say no less than 200mg/day. The amount is dependant on symptoms, the worse they are, the more is needed. Many women find they need 400mg/day to begin with, this ensures excess oestrogen is suppressed and progesterone becomes dominant. Oestrogen does affect blood glucose adversely, see here. As you can see progesterone doesn't. You are right about the stress dropping progesterone levels, vitamin D drops too. In fact your daughter's diabetes is due to a lack of vitamin D in utero. No fault of yours, but all the pre-natal vitamins dished out are far too low in vitamin D. Plus the doctors etc advising their pregnant patients don't seem to know about it's importance, see here, here, here, here, here, here, here and here. Vitamin D also helps stabilise an unbalanced blood glucose. I know you've had all your children, but please look through our Pregnancy page. Continued below

Dec 02, 2012
Hormonal Imbalance Part 2
by: Wray

Hi there At the bottom are some excellent videos about the importance of vitamin D during pregnancy. You are in Peri-menopause, this starts anywhere between 5 to 10 years before Menopause, the average age of this is 51. Please have a vitamin D test done, and for your diabetic daughter, if not all the children. For more info on vitamin D levels, test kits etc see the Vitamin D Council, GrassrootsHealth and Birmingham Hospital. Blood levels should be 70-100ng/ml (175-250nmol/L) and not the 30ng/ml (75nmol/L) most labs and doctors regard as adequate. The minimum daily dose should be 5000iu's per day, although recent research indicates it should be 10,000iu's per day, see here. A lack of vitamin D also reduces the benefits of progesterone. You might like to look through this site on diabetes and Raw For 30 Days. It does reverse Type 2 diabetes, and in one case a man with Type 1. Take care Wray

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