Burning tongue and excessive saliva

by Lisa
(Montreal)

Hello, I posted on this site and ordered the product and was very satisfied. I did not replenish my order once my 3 tubes ran out. My hot flashes are now subsiding and I did not feel the need to continue. I now am experiencing very strange symptoms and am wondering if they are related to menopause. In August I started to get a burning sensation on one side of my tongue it now has spread to the other side and in the middle also. The burning comes and goes so I did not worry to much about it but in the last 2 weeks I am secreting so much saliva that I have to spit it out and it tastes very acidic and smells awful. Again this does not happen every day but when it does I find it very uncomfortable and am wondering if it is an hormoranl issue related to menopause. Does anyone else out there experience this, I am 53 and have stopped menstruating now for 3 years. I have searched the internet and they do mention burning tongue as a menopausal symptom but the excessive acidic saliva is never mentioned, should I be concerned.

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Oct 07, 2013
Burning tongue and excessive saliva
by: Wray

Hi Lisa I'm glad you liked the cream and it helped you. No one seems to know the cause of burning tongue syndrome (BTS). These are a few sites with info on it, see here, here and here. It does appear to be more common in women who are stressed. But as it affects more women than men, and it's more prevalent during the last three years of Peri-menopause and into Menopause, than during our earlier years, this makes me suspect oestrogen, it's an excitatory, inflammatory hormone. There are ample nerve fibres in the tongue containing substance P. This is a nociceptive neuropeptide, causing pain and nausea. No one seems to know why substance P is in the neurons, but one study concludes "These data suggest that substance P may play a role in taste and/or in oral pain", see here. Oestrogen appears to amplify it's signal, whereas progesterone decreases it, see here. But substance P suppresses progesterone, see here. Although progesterone does suppress substance P, but only if enough is used, see here. The paper says "Accumulating evidence indicates that the neuropeptide substance P is predominantly involved in neurogenic inflammation and pain perception...... Intriguingly, decreased pain sensitivity is found to be associated with high plasma progesterone levels. We hypothesize that progesterone may attenuate nociception and associated inflammatory response." Mood changes, especially Anxiety and depression have been consistently found in people with BTS. This is again indicative of high oestrogen, low progesterone. Another interesting feature is a disturbance in taste, this could be due to a lack of zinc. And a lack of zinc has been found in people with BTS. Oestrogen suppresses zinc, and increases copper, progesterone raises zinc and suppresses copper. Copper can cause severe depression and psychosis. Continued below

Oct 07, 2013
Burning tongue and excessive saliva Part 2
by: Wray

Hi Lisa There is evidence that excess copper can cause ptyalism. vitamin D is a potent anti-inflammatory and analgesic, magnesium is an analgesic too. Low magnesium will cause pain. Studies have discovered magnesium depletion allows substance P to increase, and subsequently inflammatory cytokines to increase too, see here and here. Magnesium is the most important co-factor for vitamin D, an imbalance between the two causes pain. Please consider taking some if you're not. Progesterone lessens the Stress response, but if we're stressed, the level drops. These are a few more papers on BTS, see here, here and here. Excessive saliva is called ptyalism, it can occur in the first weeks of pregnancy, which is a result of changing hormone levels. Progesterone is increasing, but in doing so it stimulates oestrogen with all it's attendant symptoms. It's not until progesterone levels rise and suppresses the oestrogen, do the symptoms go. This paper here says "the patients always complain of bad taste". This is another paper here. This is a general overview of ptyalism. And another here. You could try progesterone again. But please add 100mg/day zinc, plus 5000iu/day vitamin D and 800mg/day magnesium for a month, and see if this helps. Take care Wray

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